Third Party Tools / Segment AutoWelder for GG v2.0

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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 14th Feb 2016 15:53
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it's ok , was just having a bit of fun with images, I won't be adding that pic in the next version
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ozziedave
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Posted: 15th Feb 2016 00:23 Edited at: 15th Feb 2016 00:26
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Hi BOTR, What is the Benefit of splitting the Level into different Parts ?.

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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 15th Feb 2016 06:58 Edited at: 15th Feb 2016 06:59
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@ozziedave- if you go to this thread, https://forum.game-guru.com/thread/213393?page=10#msg2540789 , there are 4 pics I uploaded showing differences in level scenes with and without breaking levels up.
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ozziedave
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Posted: 15th Feb 2016 23:01
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I missed that post, I understand the logic now...
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 16th Feb 2016 07:30
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@ozziedave-no worries, it seems to improve performance too as well as shadows/lighting. Also, you don't have to use the "chunk" option either, you can just export as one piece but won't get the added benefits.
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Nomad Soul
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Posted: 16th Feb 2016 22:15
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Yeah so every time I look at this thread, I'm amazed at the progress being made.

We are reaching a point now where Lee really needs to look at this and ensure GG issues like AI navigation and lighting are bumped up the priority list to support the great work you are doing. I would be very disappointed if this tool ran out of steam because the main engine itself is letting the side down.

At least you can focus on the part selection tools and front end for now as I'm finding there are so many new features its difficult to understand how everything works and fits together. Anything you can do to streamline the workflow and UI would be appreciated.

Really nice to see what can be achieved by a pro coder and glad I backed this awesome tool.


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Posted: 17th Feb 2016 08:06 Edited at: 17th Feb 2016 08:21
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@NomadSoul-many thanks for your comments, very much appreciated. For the "part" selection now, I was originally going to have buttons but I think it would be better (no idea why I didn't do this at the beginning) but I think just a simple point and click and right mouse for example to deselect as I don't like those checkboxes. My other visions are a drag 'n' drop feature so that you can just drop an FPS or Universe.DBO onto the executable and it will pop up with a quick option box maybe, the user then ticks a few options or not and then off it goes and generates the level/segment. Also, I want to properly setup a configuration file (.ini) so that it retains user options so there is no need to keep resetting them.
Also, the new GUI will have toolboxes where required and preference settings etc, thought it was about time to revamp and add the bells/whistles ha

I hope AI do get sorted as they are quite a disappointment at the moment, I'd have thought they could at least go above 0 level by now but I know TGC will be "loosening" the engine so that there will be less hard coded stuff which will be great for development.
Loads of ideas floating around which I want to see realised for this tool. Segment Editor will be inbuilt into the tool but the Construction kit will be separate software

I made the decision to remove the Demo version as it's very out of date and a bit redundant.
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 17th Feb 2016 12:20
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Currently rewriting the code that "welds" the segment parts together which will see a new approach plus user will be able to have camera and object movement control plus there will be buttons + keyboard controls as well as "part" selection/deselection by point and click. This is going to be fun and hopefully a lot lot better.
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 17th Feb 2016 15:34
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This is prob not very important but was thinking of removing the social website links, does anyone really use these...I know I don't ; -) if you do then I'll keep em in...not a big deal
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 17th Feb 2016 15:49
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ok a bit of a GUI new look taster...bet you thought "why don't he use ticks for some of the options?".......
Anyway, don't worry I know the change texture buttons not in place yet but will be soon.....

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Lance
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Posted: 17th Feb 2016 16:49 Edited at: 17th Feb 2016 16:50
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"was thinking of removing the social website links" , I don't use them either . The new version you are working on is looking good. Can't wait to try it out .
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ozziedave
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Posted: 17th Feb 2016 22:36 Edited at: 17th Feb 2016 22:37
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Social Website Links, we could find them ourselves I guess. Would never use F T L anyway, like the new look, I was going to post about those small picture buttons, glad you changed your mind about them. I am using Scenes from previous FPSC games to great effect, they are looking good, thanks to Segment AutoWelder.

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seppgirty
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Posted: 17th Feb 2016 23:04
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I can do without the website links too.

I would like to see this program as a single window. It's not a big deal but i find it always looks more professional. Gimp used to bug the heck out of me when it was multiple windows.

The drag and drop of files to open them sounds great.

just as a side note.... I've used this to place levels in copper cube game engine, Dx studio, and Iclone. I love this freakin' tool BOTR. So glad i bought it. Keep up the good work man.
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 18th Feb 2016 07:34 Edited at: 18th Feb 2016 07:51
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@ozziedave-scene looks good, thanks for posting.
@seppgirty-Do you mean have the GUI and preview window as one? This could be done, I think I was trying not to clutter the preview window with buttons and menus, but could make it bigger and add the GUI to the main preview window. What do other people think? Also, glad the levels are working for you, not used copper cube or iclone but have tried Dx studio which is pretty good.

Think drag 'n' drop will really be good, maybe even being able to drag the level or segment files onto the preview window.......

This morning prior to work, will be continuing with the mouse selection/deselction of the "parts" within the preview window, and if everyone likes the idea of one window I can move the GUI over to the preview window also and make it larger. Will have to add a preferences option so you can select window size etc ??

@All-ok so I'll def remove the website links
Wow, loads of changes/improvements, this is going to be fun....
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Posted: 18th Feb 2016 12:42
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One window interface I would prefer too.

Copper Cube is OK I found and can import FPSC/GG entities as fbx no problem though CC characters had some issues with collision last time I tried it. The good thing is it publishes as web gl......

....on a note of fbx - I would like to ask if it may be possible to be able to export from this tool other than in the .dbo format at some time maybe .x or .dbo?

I am having problems theses days with .dbo with progs I had used in the passed to open, covert .dbo to .x or something I can edit and work with - some have passed into history, TGC software has been removed from sales and some of the model editor progs I bought from them no longer work? Windows 10, Direct x 9 who knows - whatever .dbo is dead and only about of any use to GG internally - thats not going to get any better now. No GG model editor as such internally either so no help gonna come there either....

I tried opening a converted level .dbo from welder into fragmotion and it failed - perhaps GG now users compressed files or something - who knows. Whatever I don't seem to have anything that will open .dbo to edit, convert and output again and I aint buying anything else just to do that - given I doubt I will do anything with GG anyway but it may help the tool by being helpful to users generally speaking.

GG On the shelf at the moment with me.

Ignore me just a few thoughts.

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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 18th Feb 2016 13:01
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@Uman-thanks for the comments/feedback. I managed to load into Fragmotion .DBO level files that were split into chunks by importing the first piece then merging with other pieces. I do want to look into exporting out into other formats so the tool is not solely compatible with GameGuru. Exporting to X format is straightforward though not sure about the texturing, will need to look into that. Will look into other formats other than DBO/.X.
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Uman
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Posted: 18th Feb 2016 14:09
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Hi Mike,

I was actually able to import a single segment to Fragmotion and that's where I thought it would be good to have selection of parts visually - as I wanted to edit the segment there to isolate the parts I wanted as I found it difficult inside the tool to isolate what I wanted. I had thought it might be possible to visually select by selecting the parts in the view window itself originally - as in a whole level conversion select boxes/image part thumbnails could possibly amount to thousands of parts as some of my level have that many. Thats a lot of check boxes or thumbs ....

Anyway that's when I tried importing a whole level - a big one into fragmotion which failed with me - perhaps due to complexity.

I am looking forward also to your proposed new building tool/construction tool to see what that will be like. Is it intended to be for non FPSC objects or both those from the weld tool and perhaps other models too?

Currently until GG gets some methods to have Characters make proper use of any constructions of any kind anyway its all a mute point. Even then I don't see them ever being acceptable for me so I am more interested in the tools for non Game level development perhaps where character interaction is not required or very basic low end character behaviours will suffice, if I ever find a use for it that way. Generally speaking characters are good to have in any 3D environment and people want and expect to see professional quality at least in the professional commercial arena and personally too even for my own use I cant live with characters that behave like idiots.

To take full advantage of your tools I would need to see GG construction/world object management and characters surpass FPSC and current GG standards by far akin to modern standards, including improved character behaviors and lip Sync as FPSC had in at least a limited way.

That will give you a lot of time to complete your tools wont it.


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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 18th Feb 2016 20:37
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@Uman-No definite decisions at the moment on the construction kit, although I would definitely like it to be able to handle other objects that are not necessarily FPSC/GG formats.

I have now started to redo the GUI, while making updates/improvements to the 3.5.7 version of the tool and have now made it all in one window and am adding user option to select whatever screen resolution they want from available modes. No screenshot yet as ... well.... it's a bit of a mess but don't let that worry you, it's all part of development ha
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Posted: 19th Feb 2016 08:54 Edited at: 19th Feb 2016 12:02
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so now application is contained all in 1 window, I'm having to go back to the basics with the menu system and other GUI functions. I've also moved the background color option to the edit menu.

[update-does anyone actually use screen resolutions with depth of 16 anymore? - if not I could remove those from the list]
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Posted: 19th Feb 2016 12:49 Edited at: 19th Feb 2016 12:51
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Hi Mike, loving your work here. Its great to see work in the pipeline over the past following 11 pages. and I thank you for the video logs.

*Some users here, depending on age of course may remember me breaking up levels to eliminate bugs and to be able to run over 10 levels in a build.
So you are taking the right approach with break downs. Its really interesting because I had just started looking into export .dbo files in fragmotion. A workflow that a forum user and good friend Redeye explained once to the community. Then I stumble on this...... Amazing *someone get this guy a badge

All the best, you have a supporter. Its really refreshing seeing your work ethics and look forward to more from this. Very talented.

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seppgirty
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Posted: 19th Feb 2016 23:29
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Quote: "update-does anyone actually use screen resolutions with depth of 16 anymore?"


Not sure if people still do. I think i use 32 bit

liking the new look of a single window. Good going.
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Posted: 20th Feb 2016 04:43 Edited at: 20th Feb 2016 05:47
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Yeah I have to agree with Seppgirty. 32bit standard.
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 20th Feb 2016 07:15
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thanks guys, I've removed the 16bit depth resolutions from the menu
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Posted: 20th Feb 2016 20:17
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coming along good.
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 21st Feb 2016 08:32
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thanks , still loads to do.....
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Posted: 21st Feb 2016 09:38 Edited at: 21st Feb 2016 09:44
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busy day yesterday and not much programming done, but this morning been continuing with the rebuilding of the new GUI for the app. As you can see from screenshots have started to add toolbar + images, tooltips and hotkeys. The hotkeys and images may change, just seeing which ones I prefer.
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seppgirty
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Posted: 21st Feb 2016 14:09
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Looks good. Will you have a icon or text for every action or will we still have to remember hot keys? Like close camera with mmb or the program will crash. I'm not the biggest fan of hot keys only.
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Posted: 21st Feb 2016 15:16 Edited at: 21st Feb 2016 16:32
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@Seppgirty- oh no definitely will be buttons for actions e.g. camera, saving etc,,,,the hotkeys are just an addition for users that like them. Middle Mouse button will be redundant.
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2016 06:41
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Hi all, just wanted to highlight that version 3.5.6 was released to all that purchased a while ago, please let me know if you didn't receive links. If you didn't I will resend as sometimes emails go to the junk folder
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2016 13:15 Edited at: 23rd Feb 2016 13:15
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last night spent a small amount of time and thinking about what should go into a segment/construction kit and also played around with some code to produce a random textured/size floor for the editors which I'm hoping users can customise. Segments will no longer be restricted to 100x100 and this applies to height as well so hopefully mini prefabs could be created. Pieces should snap together and the tools should have some sort of UV mapping ability. I want the tools to be flexible so that you can build pretty much anything with them.
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Super Clark
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2016 19:18
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Love this app very much, not tested the latest version as my Norton AV keeps deleting it soon as I unzip the files
says it is unsafe to run. any ideas ?
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2016 19:54
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it's norton throwing out a false positive. I will scan the files using my virus checker, but should be ok as it's never picked it up as a virus.
You should be able to temporarily disable Norton and unzip the executable.
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2016 21:12
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Thanks Bored of the Rings mate
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Super Clark
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Posted: 24th Feb 2016 03:36
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Hi mate it say the Threat name is SONAR.Heuristic.142
HiGH RED and just gets deleted once I reactivate AV everytime?
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Posted: 24th Feb 2016 07:27 Edited at: 24th Feb 2016 07:32
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@SuperClark-I would remove the file(s) , scan your PC for any viruses and if your PC is clean, try the new link for 3.5.6 that I sent to everyone that purchased recently. I have this morning run my virus checker against all 3 files in Dropbox and no threats were found, so 3.5.6 should be ok.
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Posted: 26th Feb 2016 05:51 Edited at: 26th Feb 2016 05:55
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Heuristic. this is an imperfect (usually radical ass covering) solution to anything which relies on a maybe,perhaps or a but. You will have to add the program as an exception in Norton so that it doesn't keep deleting the exe or even better get rid of Norton..
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Posted: 1st Mar 2016 21:10 Edited at: 3rd Mar 2016 20:49
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[edited my comment]
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2016 00:02
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What happened BOTR? Why would you give up on this great program? Let us know if we can help you.
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2016 00:19
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Wow ...That was sudden ?
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Lance
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2016 00:32
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Very disappointing .
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2016 01:12
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"It's a shame but after slow progress with GameGuru, I have decided not to continue development of the tool."
I would have though this would allow you time to enhance the gui and code. is this to be temperary, or for good. If so is there going to be a final reliease
of the software. Thank you in advance for anymore Information on this matter.
Addicted to Coding.

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Uman
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2016 09:00
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Quote: "It's a shame but after slow progress with GameGuru, I have decided not to continue development of the tool"


I can fully understand the slow progress thing.

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synchromesh
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2016 09:16
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So does this mean its no longer for sale at all ?
The only person ever to get all his work done by "Friday" was Robinson Crusoe..
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Nomad Soul
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2016 09:29
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Yeah so I can also understand why he is frustrated. You are giving up a lot of spare / family time to develop an awesome tool which is being completely let down by issues with the main game engine itself.

Lack of a proper lighting solution have meant we now have to break levels up into sections and piece them together which is workable but hardly ideal and AI is completely incompatible at the moment which is a real shame. These are 2 areas which should have clearly been dealt with by now.

According to the voting board, AI navigation is in 3rd place behind save / load and easy building editor. I'm assuming Lee wants to implement the easy building editor as this will form the basis for the AI update 'Enemy bots will be able to navigate around multi-story levelled buildings.'

However this does not guarantee the AI will work on levels imported from this tool and we could be waiting months for that update. Its more likely the AI update will be directly tied into the easy building editor solution and will not be a general purpose solution for any type of geometry.


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MK83
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2016 22:26
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Quote: " I have decided not to continue development of the tool."
that sux .
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Super Clark
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2016 00:13
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This Sux I bought it too, Finally got it to work was looking forward to the next update. very nice app and now
once again because GG is still not as it should be and looks like it's going to be a long road to getting to were
you can make a full game that works...

If you are will Bored of the Rings, can you at least let us have final release with the updates you stated
we could expect please.

Thank for all the work you did also on this niffty little app.
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synchromesh
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2016 00:15
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Quote: "However this does not guarantee the AI will work on levels imported from this tool"


Why would that be ?
There models just like any other from the store or created in a program that you import yourself ?
All those would have to work
The only person ever to get all his work done by "Friday" was Robinson Crusoe..
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devlin
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2016 06:25
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"However this does not guarantee the AI will work on levels imported from this tool"


yes it is a shame and understand your frustration with A.I problems with how to get A.I working not only with
your tool. but all store media created, who knows what lee has planned and if indeed all building packs made
by artists will work with any sort of proper collision and path finding, this should be a concern for all artists
as it probably holds back sale of the building packs made by artists, in fear they will not be compatible with
gg and A.I as we have no real offering from TGC what they have planned regards A.I collision path finding or even
waypoint controll. i have myself purchased many packs hopefully they will be compatible with what ever TGC decide
to do. last time i looked at the voting board building editor and A.I navigation were top of the list why are these two
separate votes surely they fall under the same category as one should work with the other. its only logical that
they work together. as i have said work arounds are not a solution just delays what needs to be done creating frustration
not only for users but any artists who want to create media for the community.
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2016 07:11 Edited at: 3rd Mar 2016 07:52
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sorry guys, I was having some problems and also couldn't get the program to do something I wanted it to so was "throwing a tantrum" ha ..... very very sorry, I will be continuing with development of this tool......once again sorry for my sudden "throwing in the towel" statement, if I did that every day at work I'd be out of a job....... (I also was a wee bit drunk when I put the statement on thread, not my best move). Sometimes, programming can be frustrating.

Next version will actually be 3.6 and not 3.5.7 due to the GUI overhaul.......
Professional Programmer: Languages- SAS (Statistical Analysis Software) , C++, SQL, PL-SQL, JavaScript, HTML, Darkbasic Pro (still love this language), Purebasic, others
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Interests: Drumming, Saxophone, Art, Theatre, Music.
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Super Clark
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2016 10:20
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You Da Man, Thank you Bored of the Rings mate looking forward to the next build. also by the way is there a way to
have the option out put to .x or dbo ? as It would be a nice addition.

Anyhow Love your work and thanks again for continuing with the advancement6 of this great little BIG app.
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