meant to add that I have also sent out a link to the video guide for the 3.5.6 version to all that have purchased.

Only thing when the level isn't flat on top of the terrain is that pressing TAB key just makes the level disappear but the grouping works no problem. Lowering the level flat on top of the terrain allows clipping functionality to work correctly. Anyone find this is the same for them?

Hi Mike,

What exactly do you mean by "Clipping"

Like some others I don't use occlusion at all if that's what you mean so as to prevent severe popping of objects.

I don't use any particular LOD settings either other than what level I can get away with by trial and error in each level so I don't get the same as above.

e.g. avoid any visual infringement on the game play experience.

Peter

@Uman-you can clip or remove the ceilings so that you can place entities/trigger zones etc inside levels/buildings easily by pressing the TAB key and also using the CTRL+mouse wheel to raise/lower the clipping level. It seems this only works if the level is flat on the terrain, which is a shame, unless I need to verify my local files again

playing around with scaling the level, will be interesting to see how it comes out or if it's a total disaster

ok so scaling the level 200% as a whole was interesting, good side I can now walk freely in the tunnels (see pic), down side is not all the level got exported due to scaling probably surpassing the FPSC maximum universe size (see pic). Still enjoyed that wee tweak.

Hi Mike,

Ah! That clipping. No not tried that. I will have a go at it soon as.

I think GG actually in some things as you have said is hard coded to work only within a low height above the flat terrain as when it comes to buildings as and such like by default its not yet designed fully to take account of players going inside buildings and so on.

I find the lock object and the transparency it brings forth is a bind as I can never quite tell whats, what. I don't really get a problem placing stuff - though entities on the end of the cursor don't seem most often to be able to jump to the top of object (return) parts say a half height roof. They usually want to place themselves just above the terrain so I always have to lift them up manually no matter how high a building. One just gets used to a method and it becomes not so difficult once you find one that suits.

I am scaling everything up to 130 and may go to 140 at the end of the day as I am finding when I add single swing doors they are a bit tight for the player to get through as they subtract a little from the opening width. I don't get any problems so far with object size with the largest level I converted. 200 is OK I am sure and not out of place in GG unless it affects collision?
It's not a problem for a user to sale in the .fpe or perhaps you could include a scale choice. Doing it in the fpe means one can easily amend and scale it without redoing in your tool. On the other hand good to have the ability to do it in the tool as some users may not be good at even editing .fpe files which is fair enough I guess.

@Uman-I'll have to try the scaling in the FPE also and see what happens, having some fun with this. I think I used 200% as an exagerrated scale to start with and will try different values. I will also adapt the universe size if need be and see what happens. I'll see if it's better to scale in the program or in the FPE. It's all a bit trial and error.

this morning have been playing around further with scaling of FPSC levels for GameGuru and also breaking up to into pieces. I think I will now start to implement user options to select a scale and chopping up the level. Of course, there is also the scale option in the FPE file, will test further to see if there is any benefit doing it programatically or doing it in the FPE.
After that, I have loads of things to work on, but no real solid order of what stuff to focus on.
I can either focus on the Dynamic Entities, Segment Editor, DNS texturing, a new GUI, Punch/Weld tool buttons or just keep reviewing my code and fine tune everything done to date+any other fixes that need my attention.

A problem on my end ?

I build a small 'level' in Classic and then try to use it in SegWelder and have a few problems .'Welder won't recognize "universal.dbo " . It keeps saying it needs "UNIVERSAL.DBO" . I have been unzipping and renaming universal to match what's being asked for . Also 'Welder' doesn't want to do the unzip for me . The zip file is buried in the 'Level' folder (is that where it's supposed to be ?). I think some of this stuff is on my end but I can't seem to figure out why . I don't seem to have the latest video 3.5.6 ..

Hope this all makes sense ..

I just tried it again and now it accepts lower case 'universal' .
" GOOD GRIEF CHARLIE BROWN"
Lance

@Lance-I'm assuming you have Winrar installed as the tool uses that to unzip automatically. Sorry you didn't get the video 3.5.6 update, I sent to all emails on my list but I'll resend the link to you just in case

[update - I'll also tweak the code so that it recognises lower/upper case of universe.dbo.]

@Lance-resent to your email address, apologies again.

Got the file . Thanks

I am getting 'UNIVERSAL.DBO' error . I do not use WINRAR . I use Unziplite .
Pic 2 shows a missing texture from a test build . Stock Sci Fi textures from FPSC . It has happened before . Always seems to be an
outside one which shows correctly in the FPSC editor and final game build .. Pic 2 shows the inside texture on both the inside and outside . It looks to me that a texture 'panel' is missing only in the one section ..

@Lance--Unfortunately, the program as it stands uses Winrar embedded CLI commands to zip/unzip archive files during the automated FPSC level import/export process and also for archiving single segment pieces. It's ok, you don't have to use Winrar, so I'm assuming you are manually extracting the universe.dbo from the archive file?
I'll have a look into the missing texture/panel issue as I'm overhauling the FPSC level code at the moment to make way for the additional 'breaking up in chunks' option and other improvements.

Has anyone else experienced the universe.dbo error as I've not come across this? If the file is corrupt there isn't anything I can do.
I will be removing the initial FPSC level process that shows the level being put together as this isn't really needed and will save time.

my focus will be on FPSC level update to include scale and breaking into smaller chunks features. Scaling works fine so you have a choice of editing the FPE or setting the scale within the tool, tried up to 400% so far and comes out fine in GameGuru.
After these 2 updates, I will go back to the Punch/Weld tool and add in the much needed positioning/rotation buttons/XYZ value boxes etc, and then other things such as the Segment Editor and Dynamic entities.
Redesigning of the GUI will be done at later date and will be a big major release probably version 4.0 of the tool, but that's a bit way down the line somewhere.
I won't be posting much now if at all for a while until all the above is done.

I found a copy of WinRAR on another hard drive I saved from my laptop . Installed it on my PC and now no more problems with the 'universe' file . I didn't know you hardcoded WinRAR commands into 'Welder' .
That's one problem I solved . I am still having a problem with the exterior 'panel' . It shows what is supposed to be on the inside (inside and outside show the same ) .

Hi Mike, do I qualify for 3.5.6? Didn't get any email. no worries if not. Cheers Ed.

@cybernescence-you sure do-sorry I don't know what happened I sent out email to all that purchased but for some reason didn't reach a couple of people. I'll send as soon as possible.

Hi Mike,

Version 3.5.6 seems to be in permanent error for me trying to convert a single segment...

After loading and welding it displays in the Show Case Window, but I am unable to save it. If I select the camera button the SC Windows stays open and the Save button remains greyed out. I end up with both Windows displaying but a frozen software.

Is there anything special I should be doing or another option to save other than the save button as it is not available to me - so I guess saving wont work anyway.

The only thing I can do is click the camera button and it makes a sound and that's it - cant even find the thumbnail.

I have to force close using task manager as nothing works including "quit".

I have attached a screen shot of the two windows - as you can see its a very basic simple single segment I am trying to convert here in this attempt. Tried others but same result.

I have to go back to use version 3.5.5 which still works. No idea why there should be one working and one not.

Peter

@Uman-did you press Q or middle mouse button to quit the showcase window? This info should be in the videos. Once you quit the screen, you should be able to save. Let me know if you still have problems. I will send out an fixed 3.5.6 version as I have made some small updates. After that I won't be on the forums for a while till the next major release is completed

Working now, Q id it - I missed that in the video it seems. Sorry.

W.A.S.D keys I believe is for moving through level but don't seem to work for me. That's not needed really so no worries.

Go have a break from the Forums.

Thanks again for your help.

@Uman-glad it now works for you-I think the next major update will have more user buttons added-I probably should have done it from the start so that there is an "EXIT" button or similar as well as using the Q key. Once the GUI is overhauled there will most likely be a toolbar/button for most things, the basic GUI that exists at the moment was just to get the program up and running and now it's well overdue an overhaul.
for the WASD keys, they should work as it uses universal key codes. May not work if you have your CAPS LOCK is on but I can update that.

yep. all the time.

@seppgirty-Please can you give me some more info.
What OS are you running?
Does it happen on all versions or just a particular version?
Are you running with "run as administrator" ticked/checked?
Do you have a screenshot/short video you could provide me?

As I don't get this error, it's hard to find the reason why other users are getting it.
cheers

so had a little fun shifting vertices around using the universe.dbo object. result is a bit odd......ignore the GG texture......

doh- silly me forgot to include 0 vertex when shifting now fixed which means can chop it up and set the initial position on the terrain floor if need be
test universe.dbo is of the original WW2 level in FPSC....ignore the default GG textures.. this is simply a self training exercise

at last, finally fixed the FPSC level positioning in my C++ code which means no more re-adjusting the imported FPSC level which also fixed a few other issues which I hadn't seen before. So the next major release of the tool will see big changes/improvements to the FPSC level import/export.

@Lance-I have found the issue you are having with the FPSC levels-again a silly error in my code, but never fear all these fixes will be in the next update

here is the ww2 level split into 6 pieces with complete texturing + fixed XYZ coords, only thing to do now is figure out where they go ha
so at least now I can split the levels into any amount of chunks I want , kinda like mini prefabs, but not sure it will be for everyone but the option will be there.

Hi Mike,

Sorry this is probably a silly suggestion(s) as I have no idea what I am talking about of course but is there no way to get the tool to either name the pieces in a human understandable way e.g. name1, name2 in any kind of logical order starting from top left as an example?

or have them export and retain their piece positioning from FPSC when imported to GG (e.g. position on import, 2 top right of 1, 10 below 1etc, so that the user could then group them before moving them together.

I guess you would already be doing whatever you can that can be done and I am just way off whats possible as said having no idea whatsoever about the difficulties other than knowing it must be very hard for you.

I don't want you to waste your time with a reply - just commenting in case of any help at all.



Peter

@Uman-you are correct of course. At the moment it's just me playing around with test code and getting to break up the level and texture it as well as shifting the vertices. Eventually, I want to be able to have logical names that make up the pieces so that they are easier to put together as at the moment not very practical, even I am having a hard time putting them together unless I split into 2 pieces So yes, you are right, the next step will be to find a way of achieving this. Unfortunatley, each consecutive mesh that makes up the level are not necessarily in the right quadrant where you would want them for splitting out. Never fear, I'm sure I will think of something.

this morning was spent seeing what difference there is when splitting levels out into smaller chunks versus having the level as a whole. Using my test program I split the level into 10 pieces and then ran the quick lightmapper F1. Then did the same for the level that was just one piece. The results are below. I am no expert in lighting/graphics but does seem there is benefit when it comes to shadows/lighting and thanks to Uman who gave me a lot of feedback, I will further test with static lights etc. Also thanks to Rolfy who gave me the idea of splitting into pieces.

I guess those are just using the default sun and the big difference is clear

FPSC level import code rewrite is coming on well and is a lot more efficient in terms of reducing the strain on resources e.g. textures. The new system only brings in unique textures for the level required and applies the texture where it's needed. The vertices that make up the FPSC level are now repositioned and the user has the option of using multiple or single texturing i.e. DNS or just default Diffuse textures. Both FPSC X10 and X9 levels have been tested out. The breaking up of the levels into pieces works a charm but still need to work out a better way of piecing them back together in GameGuru. The pieces seem to fit together starting from right handside to left handside, but I will continue to do a bit more testing. Scaling works well and this just applies the user selected scale factor to the FPE instead of applying it programmatically. I've tested both ways and there is no difference.
Once the level is sorted, I want to revisit Dynamic entities as I think this will work using some LUA code, but again will need to test it.
Hopefully, eye candy to come soon

***Please remember if you are using Win7,8/8.1/10, "run as administrator" must be checked/ticked prior to running the tool and also on some users machines the tool may need to be allowed through firewall/virus checker, although I have not found this to be the case on my machine but appreciate everyones setup is different ***

Keep on 'Welding'. Looking forward to next build .

@Lance-thanks, here is a short (ish) video showing v3.5.7 with level rewrite which sees the scaling/chopping of the level in action + new save button. Now generates unique texture list (internal). The DNS texturing for X10 levels is in the code but not kickstarted yet.

That seems to be coming along nicely.

As a matter of interest, have you tried placing any AI in this (other) level in GG and see how they behave. I understand that the tool is still under development and that AI navigation in GG, particularly regarding navigation of interior spaces is potentially going to get an update - at the end of the day AI will need to be able to respond to and navigate our constructions and navigate successfully and behave/respond to their environment and everything else somewhat better than they do now.

Currently I find they have some problems in a variety of ways as you know as could be expected perhaps and no one yet knows how things will change when GG gets further developed - if will get better or worse - presumably and hopefully better. For that we may be waiting a lot longer than this tool perhaps and wont be able to take full advantage of it until then.

Looking forward to the next update.

Keep up the good work.

@Uman-I'll do some testing with ai entities now as well as placing some lights etc and see how they behave. I think I must suffer from tunnel vision or something as I focus on one thing forgetting to test out other stuff,

Not sue it will help anyway as said as I recon we have to wait for Lee to update GG and features at the end of the day.

@Uman-I did some testing of my own and yes it seems the AI only move if the level is totally flat on the ground and not raised at all which I was expecting really. Had a problem with static lights which disappeared (which I seem to recall you had similar or same issues), dynamic lights seem ok and there seems to be some sort of watermark or reflection that appears when I go inside a building. It's a shame the AI are so disappointing.
I did a video but not sure it's worth putting up.

Yes seems to be reflective of what I have found in the current version.

Lighting seems to be a bit of a problem in a variety of ways.

AI we would not expect to be able to navigate other than at ground base level, though I also found collision to be an issue in converted levels. AI don't recognise obstacle avoidance in the vertical correctly so get stuck in walls and in fact don't avoid them correctly. Obviously they only recognise whats at their feet in this instance fully - a GG thing. Converted segments (smaller) are different and AI avoid them correctly. Result in larger converted levels is that AI behaviors become erratic - a well known thing when collision problems exist...They become and behave in a silly fashion. That's all to do with their internal mechanisms getting held up and confused. In GG much like FPSC AI response and think time are slow which is why they often take ages to attack when in close proximity to player and often lose track of the player position completely not knowing where he is - in apparent behavioural meltdown. In fact as said its an internal AI routine process/think/response time thing as existed in FPSC and is hard coded into the engine so it has less burden/strain on the engine. A level with a lot of AI characters and other dynamic entities active all at once in a level all reacting to the world and player gameplay at one time requires a lot of processing power which the engine simply does not have I guess. No 64 bit, multiple core processing here and time and data streams have to be shared so each entity has to wait for threads to finish so reactions are slow at best and if the level is complex enough and too many dynamics grind to a halt. Performance slow and behaviors erratic....

FPSC - GG nothing much changes for its time

Sorry about that. Not your problem other than it does affect you and the tool to some extent when AI is an issue. Collision and physics issues always affect AI/dynamics and cause erratic gameplay issues as when an entity gets confused/held up it impacts/compounds to all other dynamic entities and that mushrooms.

Nothing much we can do about GG internal hard coded issues.

No worries when you get the next version out I will give it a test for you so don't worry about it.

EDIT UPDATE :

Before I forget again there is one thing I meant to ask about a while ago...

At some stage perhaps relative to the tool segment editor? Would it be possible to be able to select a segment piece/part by selecting it with the mouse pointer? I found it very difficult to isolate parts I don't want exported in the segment using the number selections. In the particular instance I tried I could not seem to find the correct parts that way. Perhaps its just me

Yes, this definitely would be better, so deselecting/selecting on screen would be preferable and/or drag n drop maybe? I must admit, I'm not happy with the numbering thing either. Will add this to my list.

Hi Mike,

Thanks for that.

That would be fantastic.

I do hope you are getting good support for this so that you can keep developing it.

Not sure what TGC will come up with as their Easy Building Editor but this tool combined with the FPSC Editor (+ entities) may be a good and better substitute with a head start depending on what it ends up like if ever they get around to making the GG one. In any case this will still be a very valuable addition to the toolbox. Worst scenario is FPSC stops working on Windows software down the road but that's just being pessimistic.

Not sure I will ever make a real game with GG as I doubt it will ever be able to do what I want or even allow what I did in FPSC in my levels - long way to go before it gets there and even then it needs to exceed what FPSC could do to so I could complete even the FPSC levels I have.

Mostly I would just like to get them transferred for the sake of posterity before as suggested FPSC stops working under Windows which no doubt it will eventually do, sooner or later unless someone will updated it whilst Open Source.

Have a good weekend.

Peter

As it stands I have had around 40 people purchase the tool from around the world and my thanks goes to all those that have supported this project so far.
I probably won't make a game in game guru until there are a lot more features but have enjoyed watching it grow so far.

G' Day BOTR I like the improvements, especially the Scaling , I noticed that moving through my levels my Player was closer to the ceiling then in FPSC Levels. On Uman's comments on GG, I found that even in FPSC NPC's slowed down, and sometimes stopped altogether when a bunch of them were attacking or moving around the scene's.

I will be glad when you can move NPC's that are above 0 in scenes at the moment is frustrating to say the least. I'm with you and Uman, I don't think I will ever make the greatest game in the World, but am having fun just pottering around, let's face it the professionals have at least 60 people over three years making those top games.

@Ozziedave-G'day to you too Glad you like the scaling. Yes, it will definitely be good to have NPC's capable of moving above terrain level, although I'm not sure how long the wait will be or how long I want to wait. Will have to see what happens this year.

The FPSC level side is pretty much done now with the DNS side now kicking in which seems FPSC X10 mainly used these textures, but I've yet to find a shader that works with them apart from the standard entity_basic.fx in GameGuru. I've used Dark Shader to play around with some shaders but can't seem to get any to work even after tweaking/recompiling.

I was going to play around futher with Dynamic entities, but want to focus on the idea Uman suggested and that's to remove the horrible numbering of the segment parts and replace this with graphical representation where you can point and click and/or drag drop each part onto the screen. That will be interesting and much better. I will go back to my old code I did a while back and start to develop something a lot more sophisticated. As mentioned before the whole GUI needs a total overhaul so there will be big changes in the GUI and tool functionality, hopefully for the better.

After the point/click of parts feature, I'll concentrate on Dynamic Entites and Segment Editor + updates to Punch/Weld tool. Not sure what TGC's EBE will be like, but I may put the construction kit back on my list as I would like to program my own separate tool so if I do create one it will be a totally new tool outside of the Welder app. Will have to see

so I thought this morning, well while I play around with the new point/click code for the "parts", I would quickly add in some arrow buttons for the punch/weld tool at the same time, my attempt at multitasking

quick vid showing v3.5.7 progress with punch/weld tool and part picker test code.


Segment Editor and Construction kit still "on the cards" and will start doing some initial preparation code this week, although I had already started the Segment Editor but want it to be more flexible and sophisticated. I will also be going back to the dynamic entities and seeing if I can add those in with help from LUA. Also starting to assign buttons to images to replace the rather dull grey look.

errr maybe, maybe not ha

Wow, not sure how i feel about that.