Product Chat / Bug Fixing News

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LeeBamber
TGC Lead Developer
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Posted: 6th Jun 2019 16:00
Hi All,

I have started and stuck this thread so you can have a full conversation about the bugs that are affecting you and your game making project, and to create a central place to post your concerns. Just to start things off we have been working on bug fixes and new features this year, but they have been rolled into an alpha site development so as not to introduce more bugs in official updates. We are planning, however, to release fixes in June, taken from the issues tracker and tested through the beta and publicpreview builds which you are welcome to join.

It's been a pretty slow start for 2019 in terms of official updates, so I am hoping to redress this shortly with some key fixes and more regular news on what's happening behind the scenes. The reason for the semi-silence was that the development work has been under a sort of NDA as it's tied to a brand that we don't have full control over. As this work is almost at an end, I can start to reveal what has been created and provide full disclosure on the features yet to come.

Thanks for bearing with us during this time, and I do appreciate your patience. As always, I am still looking for freelancers who might want to help on the coding and scripting side of the engine so if you are interested, do drop me a line at lee@thegamecreators.com
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synchromesh
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Posted: 6th Jun 2019 16:21 Edited at: 6th Jun 2019 17:31
Quote: " I am hoping to redress this shortly with some key fixes and more regular news on what's happening behind the scenes. "

That will please many for sure
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Bolt Action Gaming
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Posted: 6th Jun 2019 16:38
I think this helps clear the air a bit, particular the information about the NDA. Those things always cause a black-hole style effect on info drops.

Looking forward to the update(s).
Pink Panther
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Posted: 6th Jun 2019 16:55 Edited at: 6th Jun 2019 17:03
Thanks for the information Lee!
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Teabone
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Posted: 6th Jun 2019 17:06
Thanks Lee!
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granada
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Posted: 6th Jun 2019 17:19
Any news is good news

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Argent Arts
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Posted: 6th Jun 2019 18:08
Quote: "It's been a pretty slow start for 2019 in terms of official updates, so I am hoping to redress this shortly with some key fixes and more regular news on what's happening behind the scenes. The reason for the semi-silence was that the development work has been under a sort of NDA as it's tied to a brand that we don't have full control over. As this work is almost at an end, I can start to reveal what has been created and provide full disclosure on the features yet to come."


It will be good to hear what's been going on and what features are yet to come, to be sure. However, what does a "sort of NDA" have to do with fixes to the current engine (not new features), such as the broken lighting system, incompletely implemented PBR, memory issues (stemming from level loading, etc.), etc.? Since these main issues are a current part of GG and pre-existed the "sort of NDA", why couldn't someone have at least mentioned that they are being worked on? Or are they? It's not new features that are preventing me from using GG for my current game project, but the broken lighting and memory issues, to be frank.
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Posted: 6th Jun 2019 19:18
I miss something like this
Anyway thanks Lee for coming with news.
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rolfy
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Posted: 6th Jun 2019 19:58 Edited at: 6th Jun 2019 20:33
Quote: "The reason for the semi-silence was that the development work has been under a sort of NDA as it's tied to a brand that we don't have full control over. As this work is almost at an end, I can start to reveal what has been created and provide full disclosure on the features yet to come."
Semi-silence...Total silence would be the appropriate term. So this 'sort of NDA' is tied to something that is GameGuru related? Forgive my confusion but the wording seems to suggest that it is, since you will be providing full disclosure on the features yet to come. Can't be multiplayer since you already announced that, looking forward to seeing what bug fixes you have been working on for the past six months.
The problem many users have is in trying to equate 'six months of bug fixes' which turned out to be six months of total silence apart from DLC promotions and yet more new features (only announced recently). New features are pointless when bugs need squashed and core issues addressed. I would have thought that any fixes would be openly declared and not under NDA (sort of).
If you had said you had to work on another TGC product for now and would be back in a few months with the promise to catch up it would have been more acceptable than blowing smoke. Seriously....
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Posted: 6th Jun 2019 20:43 Edited at: 6th Jun 2019 20:47
I don't think there were 6 months of bug fixing, least it wasn't concrete in stone. As Evan mentions he is now going through the github list, starting now. at the very least we now know there is some progress going on, even if that means starting now -- in regards to the topic of bug fixers. Sounds like work is being done on something much larger in the background though; unrelated to the issue tracker on github.

Would be nice to see what community work is being added. I'd like to thank BOR again for the minor fixes to some of my smaller requests. Hopefully a June fixer update can be made
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synchromesh
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Posted: 6th Jun 2019 21:49 Edited at: 6th Jun 2019 21:50
Quote: "ounds like work is being done on something much larger in the background though; unrelated to the issue tracker on github."

Agree with Teabone …
I have my own suspicions on maybe what but time will tell.
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 6th Jun 2019 22:06 Edited at: 7th Jun 2019 12:22
Yes it's called Agk studio and vulkan and OpenXR (Khronos)
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Honkeyboy
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 00:36 Edited at: 7th Jun 2019 00:44
Hi all,
Just wanted to express something as I have seen a lot of negativity towards GG not just here but on steam etc etc. I know we all want the bugs sorting but I kinda wanted to put a perspective on this. I have recorded 4 thousand hours in GG which cost me erm probably 30 quid at the time and that's just steam I used to do quite a bit offline as well. I do not have any other game, game engine or anything else even remotely close hours wise and I have 200 plus in my steam library. Yes Lee has been a bit too quiet even for my liking but it didn't help with the feeling of mass panic which I was greeted with when looking at the forums. This prompted me to look on git hub where I saw things we're being done on the alpha branch (yes I know it would have helped others to know to look there)
I'm actually looking forward to these new features Multiplayer especially just as its something new for me to get into for my 30 quid or whatever (yes I bought the dlc's as well eventually) and now we see the bugs are getting worked on, but as we know there will always be some bugs not just in this engine but all of them, we work around most of them as we learn the engine and also have help for me smallg and AM and you others out there theres lots of you (thank you) as a result of this I kinda feel the need to stick up for this product and Lee as I have had more than my monies worth already 10x and met some really decent people who really help out here on the forums, synch, wolf, Myke, Dvader, Belidos, lotr, teabone, ganada, requilia etc etc.
We are sometimes like well in my case 50 year old kids "are we there yet I need a wee!" but I do know this GG has my heart and it's been worth every penny.
p.s yes its been a long haul but lets just see whats in this new update and make some new stuff
Just my 10p's worth
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OldFlak
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 03:04 Edited at: 7th Jun 2019 06:11
@Honkeyboy - In essence I tend to agree with you sentiments here.

I have clocked about 1750 hrs according to steam, but for a couple years or so I was launching GG from desktop and bypassing Steam so it would be much higher than that I guess.

That said I still feel that TGC has put quite some distance between itself and its user-base this year. There was a time when the whole setup was like family unit, but then suddenly the parents left us all out in the cold. Remaining completely silent has just made the distance that much farther for some of us.

We used to get regular input from Lee, we knew what was being worked on - even if we didn't personally need the feature\work being done - at least we knew that something was being done. You know, we were kept in the loop.

What we need is transparency, a clear direction, and a sense of trust that TGC are serious about Game Guru.

On Topic:
PBR:
- has been added but not completed - needs proper lighting. sun light up walls on interior levels even if it is turned off in TAB TAB
Light-Mapper Broken:
- if you light-map a level with an illumination\emissive map, all illumination will be lost and the illumination map will be tiled over the model. been this way since DX11 was added
Terrain:
- used to be easy to work with now is clunky.
Terrain Painting:
- used to be able to blend edges nicely, now it is horrible to work with.
Grass:
- also is not as nice to work with as it was in DX9, and it still get areas where it pops in\out of view right in front of the player, this was a bug\feature even before DX11
Memory:
- this has been reported by many, and is a showstopper for multi-level games.

Just to name the obvious....

Reliquia....
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Ertlov
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 04:52
Dynamic Lights not casting shadows.
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Tarkus1971
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 10:12
@Ertlov - Yes dynamic lights casting shadows and the flashlight casting shadows. Ability to turn off the sun in lua too.

And a way to limit shadow distance from dynamic lights and flashlight and even the sun....... maybe there is something that has yet to be announced on this.
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MooKai
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 11:37
We need gfx quality same this and performance...
Old school FPS fan, DOOM!!! Why GG not working on my AMIGA 500?

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Tarkus1971
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 12:10
@mookai - that is from the AGK-S website ???

Vulkan in Game Guru who knows ???
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 12:24
https://www.thegamecreators.com/newsletter/thegamecreators-newsletter-8--june-2019 - have a good old read
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Argent Arts
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 12:40
Quote: "https://www.thegamecreators.com/newsletter/thegamecreators-newsletter-8--june-2019 - have a good old read"


In which nothing much is actually said that was not already known (i.e. working on VR because reasons, planning on squashing bugs, but nothing specific being said).
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Tarkus1971
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 12:43
Hopefully we will hear something more once Lee can say about the things he cannot now because of the NDA.
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OldFlak
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 13:15
Yeah, noting that couldn't have been said up-front two months ago. Would have been easier to just say GG is on the back-burner for some time to come.

I'm outa here - have fun people, hope the GG eventually becomes what you want, and you can one day make the game you hoped to make a few years ago.

Reliquia....
aka OldFlak
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Belidos
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 13:40
Quote: "So, we had planned to have a bug-fest in May, however this was absorbed into the VR work as described above. We’re back on it and are now aiming for a June release, first through beta builds and Public Preview tests, and finally as a public release to all users. If you are working on projects at the moment, it is highly recommended you switch to the Public Preview build when we announce it, as any issues can be caught and remedied before the final release."


So basically he's saying they've done practically nothing but work on a feature that is only useful to a niche user base, and middle finger to the rest of us who are waiting for bug fixes that were promised, good to know.

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Corno_1
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 14:43
Quote: "So basically he's saying they've done practically nothing but work on a feature that is only useful to a niche user base, and middle finger to the rest of us who are waiting for bug fixes that were promised, good to know."

But if a big company support GG, so GG get more money and more developers can work on it, we all profit in the long run. Sometimes the best for the product is not the best for the community in short terms.

Let´s see what we get and then we can jugde
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Loretta
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 15:29
I'm confused by the announcement, but will be patient.. I am thrilled with VR being added but not sure what that really means for GameGuru.
Does that mean we will be able to convert our GG games in GameGuru for VR ?
That would be more than I wished for but not sure that is what they mean.

Thanks for a little good news but really hope they get bugs taken care of soon.
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Belidos
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 15:37 Edited at: 7th Jun 2019 15:55
Quote: "But if a big company support GG, so GG get more money and more developers can work on it, we all profit in the long run. Sometimes the best for the product is not the best for the community in short terms.

Let´s see what we get and then we can jugde "


And if he had said earlier on that he was working on a big project that may bring money in for further development, then it wouldn't feel like the middle finger, he didn't need to give details, or break any NDA, just communicate with us, it's not hard, TGC always have been terrible at communication.

Remember, software development is like making love. One mistake and you have to support it for the rest of your life.

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Teabone
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 16:40
Evan mentioned he will be starting the bug fixes soon. Is anyone supporting with that? Will community commits be pulled to the master for June?
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UNIRD12B
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 17:29
Quote: "But if a big company support GG, so GG get more money and more developers can work on it, we all profit in the long run."


can anyone point out please where Lee said they were getting
any SUPPORT from some major company ?
All I saw was....

Quote: "The reason for the semi-silence was that the development work has been under a sort of NDA as it's tied to a brand that we don't have full control over."


Nothing about Money from some other company...rather sounded like they were going to implement
another companies product in to game Guru in order to have either VR or MULTIPLAYER support..

UNIRD12B
Let\'s actually make something happen with this one !
synchromesh
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 17:31 Edited at: 7th Jun 2019 17:32
Quote: "I have started and stuck this thread so you can have a full conversation about the bugs that are affecting you and your game making project, and to create a central place to post your concerns."

So are we going to talk about the bug fixes etc or just keep jumping down Lees' throat which is achieving nothing.
At this point perhaps we should just get on with the task at hand as we cant change anything thats happened but we can do our best to take advantage of what Lee requested above .

Sorry to see you go reliquia but I hope you keep supplying your awesome assets on the store.
( SYS )
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Tarkus1971
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 17:49
Good call synchromesh, Lee has said how things are now, so we all should try and be positive. I still use GG a lot, but I am waiting for things to settle in the bug fixing front before I carry on with main projects...... Just fiddling with LUA, Music and AGK-S too at the moment here.
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Corno_1
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 17:52 Edited at: 7th Jun 2019 17:54
@UNIRD12B You really need to calm down. It is a game engine, not your life

Quote: "can anyone point out please where Lee said they were getting"

Nowhere. This was no cite!!!! I wrote IF

Quote: "rather sounded like they were going to implement another companies product in to game Guru"

Yes. And this product can advertise GG and the other way round.
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synchromesh
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 18:09 Edited at: 7th Jun 2019 18:10
Quote: " I still use GG a lot, but I am waiting for things to settle in the bug fixing front before I carry on with main projects"

Good time to post the bugs that are really hindering your progress ... I know they probably all are but we have to start somewhere
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3com
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 18:39 Edited at: 7th Jun 2019 19:34
About new feature I'm going to do some request, in order to do so I'm going to recrete a scene as follow:

Target
Save civilians from a burning textile factory



the real goal is to get down the fire stairs with civilians to the ground.



In order to get so I would need waypoints working on uphill.
In fact I've got it but editing global.lua file, well all we know what happens with, after some update and/or file check, via steam.

Edit: Don't know whats going on with the image, if some mod can help me would be much appreciate.
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GraPhiX
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 19:23
@3com - you need to upload the image do not use a link, also the fomat needs to be .jpg once uploaded you can embed it into your post
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3com
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 19:30
Quote: "you need to upload the image do not use a link"

Do you mean using upload file button?
Does this mean I don't need image hosting?
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GraPhiX
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 19:32
Quote: "Do you mean using upload file button?
Does this mean I don't need image hosting?"


yes that is correct
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3com
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 19:35
@ GraPhiX
Cool! ty for the very useful tip mate.
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synchromesh
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 19:36 Edited at: 7th Jun 2019 19:38
Quote: "Does this mean I don't need image hosting?"

Yep .. just browse to your pic on your PC .. Upload and press the Embed button .
Remember to hit return for a new line to embed though for best results

BTW... Cool vid ...Or Hot in this case
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UNIRD12B
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 19:38
Quote: "@Cornu_1 You really need to calm down. It is a game engine, not your life--so why SPECULATE On...IFS ?"


Quote: "@Cornu_1Yes. And this product can advertise GG and the other way round."


MORE---Speculation ???

UNIRD12B
Let\'s actually make something happen with this one !
synchromesh
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 19:41
Ok lets try and stay on topic now or I may have to moderate before I let them through ..
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3com
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 19:42
@ synchromesh
Thanks 4 clarify.
In fact the player will have just some time to get it.
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Corno_1
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 19:51
@3com I can add this var to the global.lua, but just adding a var does not seem like a feature we need.
Are you allowed to share the script, so we could add it too?
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3com
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 20:36
@ Corno
Quote: "I but just adding a var does not seem like a feature we need"

Yeah I think so, that is one of the reasons that prevent me from continuing to develop the game, among others.
With the GG jump to hlsl 5.0+ breaks many of the maps using old shaders, thats mean redone all them.
Also due to this GG throws an error and does not allow to open the map to edit it, which means to do it again.
I do not know if it is worth doing nowaday, maybe in the future, who knows.

Quote: "Are you allowed to share the script, so we could add it too?"

Of course, in fact it's one of the awesome Smallg's scripts with a bit of changes to suit my needs.
Anyway you has to add ai_patrol_y = {} var to global.lua file, and if you want to go from point A thru poin B you'll has to connect waypoint from A trhu B too, like in the float mountain video.

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Corno_1
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Posted: 7th Jun 2019 21:13
Quote: "Anyway you has to add ai_patrol_y = {} var to global.lua file,"

I looked at your script and really liked it. But these arrays are not supported anymore.

Why you are not adding it to the other declared arrays in the script like this:


Then it is always there
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3com
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Posted: 8th Jun 2019 00:05
@ Corno_1
I'll do it. Thanks 4 the suggestion.
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Belidos
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Posted: 8th Jun 2019 08:48
[quote]also the fomat needs to be .jpg once uploaded you can embed it into your post[quote]

Actually jpg is the worst format to use on the forum hee because there is abug where some jpg's don't work with the attachments linking and instead of loading in the browser when clicked you end up downloading them. PNG os better to use on here.

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devlin
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Posted: 8th Jun 2019 22:33 Edited at: 8th Jun 2019 22:35
A fix for third person camera clipping would be good.

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synchromesh
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Posted: 8th Jun 2019 23:32
Quote: "A fix for third person camera clipping would be good."

Yep thats so annoying ..
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Honkeyboy
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Posted: 8th Jun 2019 23:58 Edited at: 9th Jun 2019 00:04
@ reliquial hey dude don't just go you've done some really decent stuff for GG Just do what I do when it starts getting to you take a break...I just play conan exiles or archeage or sommat for a bit Thing is with GG things never get solved in a rush so there's no point trying to rush it. I was checking out an alpha of Conan Exiles on youtube the other day where the animal taming was broken and they was doing some pretty crazy things and I think I spent the whole 20 min vid in tears. Sometimes the bugs can have some funny results.... In the words of my favourite people "Always look on the bright side of life"...….
p.s here it is check it out for BUGS!!!!!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6-jVnuvSTU
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Posted: 9th Jun 2019 01:44 Edited at: 11th Jun 2019 02:16
@3com, happy you understood my working example of waypoint/stairs and no need to use additional zones, all the best.

*Off topic, those quoting me elsewhere, I advise doing your own tests before making a game or deciding whats possible with GG. User specs can give different results as I've stated before, also consider your end user base if planing on a release, can they run it too? How you build your levels, scripts handling ect all depends on the end user. Run lots of tests. Any 32bit program has an address space, every time a user runs test game in editor you're adding memory, Save, close completely, reload GG and your saves will work. All the best

@Lee Bamber, Non bug related. Request if you can also address how single player story driven campaign games are being handled moving forward for users not interest in MP and VR? Will creating a SP game with +levels be covered in later tutorials? Thank you.

*back on topic
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