3rd Party Models/Media Chat / Wizardofid's media 4 (2019)

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wizard of id
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Posted: 4th Jan 2019 08:34 Edited at: 4th Jan 2019 08:36
New year new thread.

I am starting the year off with a scifi big bang, I loved the curved corridors I created for the Cold War DLC pack
https://store.steampowered.com/app/996910/GameGuru__Cold_War_Pack/

that I will be doing the same for the scifi corridors.This one will not contain water section, so have to add more platforms and assessable areas. Working with a single mesh and PBR is going to be a nightmare and having to figure out how I am going to fit every thing into a single atlas.Biggest issue is going to be creating the textures and normals and repeating textures making them seamless as well.The one way I can do a single mesh is to create all the normals needed in photoshop, import the color ID and paste and apply the normals to the color ID of the various sections.

It will require some planning and forward thinking, the biggest issue would be getting the UVmapped faces the correct size, so that the normals aren't stretched or too small when applied to the atlas.

This is another long term project but hopefully not as long as the Cold War pack, which to be honest I made a few mistakes, which delayed the project, however this time around I am not working towards a DLC release again, unless TGC fancies it.

Will be similar style to the stasis model pack made.
https://www.tgcstore.net/pack/10915
I am really looking forward to this, and hope you also excited to partake in this epic journey of discovery, frustration and beyond.



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wizard of id
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Posted: 4th Jan 2019 13:36
Taking shape nicely, currently thinking about the pillars, platforms and access to the lower areas.

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bluemeenie195
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Posted: 4th Jan 2019 23:08
I have a few of your packs and love them.
Can't wait to see the new one.
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Posted: 5th Jan 2019 05:45
Looking forward to how this will look with PBR and the overall improvements that have come to GG. The stasis pack was by far my favorite pack you've released and I always wanted to see more like it

Will be keeping a close eye on this!
wizard of id
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Posted: 5th Jan 2019 14:15
Currently on the first page of top sellers. Thanks for your support !!!!!


https://store.steampowered.com/search/?tags=13906&filter=topsellers
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wizard of id
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Posted: 6th Jan 2019 14:18
Still busy will the block out and will likely be for a while as I do the block out.Biggest issue is taking the space given and populating it and making it more confined, and keep all the space available.

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wizard of id
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Posted: 8th Jan 2019 17:49
Started of the weekend and most of the start of this week setting up my new SSD, So started again this evening, Some thing I discovered is that the area is still too large so needed to block it off some more to make it a smaller areas, which is perfect in that it will allow, 100's of little corridor paths and such.

Started with the upper right corridor tweaking it and fitting it exactly to the Character.

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wizard of id
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Posted: 16th Jan 2019 14:53
Some more progress made.Will need to reduce the polygons unfortunately, as I want to keep it as cheap as possible, which means I need to spend some time getting as much normal detail as possible.
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wizard of id
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Posted: 22nd Jan 2019 09:28
Started with painting the normals, going to add as much detail as possible, then start painting the textures not sure what color scheme I want.

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wizard of id
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Posted: 22nd Jan 2019 12:54
The base texture, which I quite like, going to experiment and see what a grunge scifi texture would look like with some weathering.

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granada
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Posted: 22nd Jan 2019 13:23
Looks like your getting into this one now,looking forward to it

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wizard of id
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Posted: 31st Jan 2019 14:31
Had to more experiments with regards to a single mesh, it makes painting the normals a lot more difficult, but entirely possible just going to be a mission and take awhile. But I needed to do a quick test with just a quick normal to see the result.Still room for improvement.

In case you missed I need to group all the meshes together, paint normals for all meshes, in order to make use of PBR.

So it isn't exactly pretty, but gives me a rough look at the result, which I am not happy with, the ceiling could be better for one, the addition of floor pipes adds some thing extra.So definitely be a while before you see any thing remotely gameguru like.Needs to be 100%.
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wizard of id
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Posted: 2nd Feb 2019 18:36 Edited at: 2nd Feb 2019 22:26
So took about a day to get the uvmap layout correctly scaled for the single mesh approach of painting normals and PBR, in between power cuts. (annoying I know) Working some over time this weekend to catch up. Painting the floor normal I want it to have as much detail as possible, so will take a while, as I don't want to rely on the the mesh for detail it should be as flat as possible to max polygon reduction to allow additional entity layers to make up the final corridor.





Thanks again for you support on the Cold War Pack your continued support makes it possible to tackle long term projects like this.
I you are deciding on getting the content pack, you missing out on the only curved wall level construction kit DLC for gameguru.
https://store.steampowered.com/app/996910/GameGuru__Cold_War_Pack/
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wizard of id
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Posted: 3rd Feb 2019 16:37
What it looks like so far Progress !!!
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wizard of id
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Posted: 3rd Feb 2019 19:53
Wall panels are next on the chopping block

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wizard of id
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Posted: 4th Feb 2019 15:18 Edited at: 4th Feb 2019 15:19
Time to texture added back all the duplicated mesh parts, the corridor is divided in 3 parts, because it's a single mesh I needed to add temp door arch and window arch to the single mesh, after that I can create alternatives with and without the window wall and door arches.

Currently Isolating the various parts, which wasn't included in the base color ID map.If all goes well we should have the first look in engine tomorrow.




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wizard of id
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Posted: 4th Feb 2019 18:25
ID map sorted


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wizard of id
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Posted: 4th Feb 2019 19:42
While I haven't created the alternative part as yet, wanted to do a quick engine test, get a feel for things.Some things I noticed the pipes on the floor clash a lot with the rest, so will need to choose a lighter shade.Some tweaks here and there, but pretty happy with the normals they really came out nicely. Different shades of grey works well, might tweak the black strips to a lighter shade as well.

ENJOY !





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wizard of id
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Posted: 5th Feb 2019 09:10
Because I have the source files it's pretty simple to make changes to normals and textures. Decided the floor and wall need to be more simple.Step in the right direction, couple more Color ID needed but pretty happy with the normals.Door arch may need extra love and attention.


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wizard of id
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Posted: 5th Feb 2019 13:03
Final tweaks made. Now to create the alternative sections and testing again, after which I can add the cross junction, then for the entity layers.



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wizard of id
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Posted: 6th Feb 2019 07:45
Experimenting with the light sources in the corridor, a bit much, floor and ceiling is more then enough.
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wizard of id
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Posted: 7th Feb 2019 07:40
Learned a valuable lesson today with creating a single mesh with normals, it doesn't work if you do it in parts.You have to do EVERY THING together or else you end up with normals not aligning correctly so I have to paint the normals over. I am using the the old normals as a reference point to get to look like the old one as it was pretty much perfect maybe do some light changes here and there, also added an additional wall to do a normal variation.

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wizard of id
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Posted: 7th Feb 2019 18:52
Should be able to texture tomorrow afternoon, matches previous normals with small changes for the better here and there.

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bluemeenie195
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Posted: 8th Feb 2019 00:05
Coming along nice.
Can't wait to see the full project.
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wizard of id
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Posted: 8th Feb 2019 21:44
Thanks mate still encountered a alignment issue which needed fixing, as well as fixing the corridor it self and the issue was related to the floor which meant other floor pieces were going to have an issue, should have tested early but such is life.Made sure I have 100 % perfect alignment.Also made a change to the mesh while at it, removed the floor pipes it was to distracting for me.But will add some scifi styled entity floor pieces to scatter around the corridor. 3rd time's the charm.That said it's my first really complex normals with a single mesh, learning A LOT in return even with failures.

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wizard of id
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Posted: 9th Feb 2019 09:20
Couldn't be happier. Perfect alignment !

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wizard of id
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Posted: 9th Feb 2019 17:44 Edited at: 9th Feb 2019 17:44
Quick test time small fix needed. Looks good will now need to play around with the Color ID map and find the right texture balance again

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wizard of id
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Posted: 9th Feb 2019 19:18
Color scheme done. ! Last Update for a few days while I assemble and test it out and apply a fixes if there is a need. So far only noticed two minor things that need TLC.

albedo vs PBR
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wizard of id
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Posted: 10th Feb 2019 14:36
Crossjunction test, some thing I need to change is to lighten the ceiling color, as it's too dark, no biggie.Seams are all fine too, would have like curved or angled wall but that is a problem to solve for a future pack


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wizard of id
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Posted: 10th Feb 2019 19:33 Edited at: 10th Feb 2019 19:34
Adding additional colors to the Color ID map to get the right sections, A bright colors help a fair bit.This will allow for better control overall, it means I can isolate specific smaller parts which will greatly assist in texturing.I quite like the look of the orange and black, it is limiting in the reuse and will get a bit much, which is why more neutral colors is generally used in corridors.

I like it enough to keep the scheme on hand which means, I can swap out the orange for red/blue/white and the standard more greyish neutral scheme, which will keep things interesting.Will need to add some paint bars and writing and light sources first before settling the focus right now is getting the color ID map the way I want it there is still smaller dents and bolts that can benefit from a change in color.
Once that is done the various colors scheme can be decided on and rendered.But definitely a good start.
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wizard of id
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Posted: 12th Feb 2019 07:47
The end result.However now I have to pause the project, for 2-3 weeks while I work on the cold war DLC update.
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Belidos
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Posted: 12th Feb 2019 08:19
Looks really good WoID, i like it. Although, it is a little busy and repetitive for me, could probably do with a bit more variation, but it does look good.

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wizard of id
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Posted: 12th Feb 2019 10:44
Quote: "Looks really good WoID, i like it. Although, it is a little busy and repetitive for me, could probably do with a bit more variation, but it does look good."
Pillars and such should break up the look, draw back of not being able to use modular pieces as you would in other engines, to make reuse easy and straight forward. The benefit however is the massive reduced draw calls in gameguru and stupidly easy placement.

Orange also makes patterns standout even more, greyish color theme hides quite a bit. Variation and ease of use is always going to be a battle with gameguru.

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Belidos
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Posted: 12th Feb 2019 10:56 Edited at: 12th Feb 2019 11:13
Yeah, the snapping system in GameGuru is a bit awkward when compared to other engines, i don't know what it is, but it's just awkward to model for it. Maybe if the grid squares were smaller it would work better?

I started a project similar to this a couple of years ago, but gave up because the snapping in GameGuru was driving me nuts.


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wizard of id
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Posted: 12th Feb 2019 13:48
First new model for the Cold war DLC, Club S Cruise missile (3M-E14), took a while to get a decent full recent image. Put a decent amount of detail at the back, the rest I will do with normals. to get the detail just right.I don't think I will add the full fin control system, and just fake what I can.

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wizard of id
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Posted: 14th Feb 2019 14:07
Next WIP MK39.Quite the beast




Club S done
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wizard of id
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Posted: 14th Feb 2019 16:17
Just the back fins needs now.

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wizard of id
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Posted: 14th Feb 2019 19:16
Texture WIP

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Wolf
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Posted: 14th Feb 2019 23:17
Damn fine work, m8!
wizard of id
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Posted: 15th Feb 2019 11:01
Thanks mate, wasn't entirely happy with the MK39, so made some minor changes. Much better, will be adding a rusty version as well.

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wizard of id
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Posted: 17th Feb 2019 06:22
Old shell crate.

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wizard of id
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Posted: 18th Feb 2019 08:44
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wizard of id
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Posted: 18th Feb 2019 18:00
Much better

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wizard of id
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Posted: 21st Feb 2019 07:39
Tried to reduce the polygon count as much as possible on the ULC
loader, best I could do is 12K, was originally 16K.Still have to add
the metal clips to strips, 60 odd polygons there.Rest I can do with
normals, like the indents on the artillery tubes end.Minor problem with the reduced polygons the gaps are larger then what I would have liked.

Regardless well worth it. Now to texture.

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wizard of id
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Posted: 21st Feb 2019 09:08
Just requires a decent dirt map

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Belidos
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Posted: 21st Feb 2019 09:19
Looks really good, as to poly count, could you not do the tiny plates under the handles via normals? It won't reduce it by much, but every poly helps.

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wizard of id
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Posted: 21st Feb 2019 10:03 Edited at: 21st Feb 2019 10:06
Quote: "Looks really good, as to poly count, could you not do the tiny plates under the handles via normals? It won't reduce it by much, but every poly helps."

Handles are only on the outside of artillery tubes, and dirt cheap already, so not worth it.The tubes only have 8 corners, regardless 12K is still dirt cheap and reasonable for gameguru.

Already getting headaches with regards to the next model, which I want to keep under 25K, if you export directly to DBO, you bypass the issue of X file limitations, the likely hood is it is going to end up closer to 35K.

SA10 (grumble) Mobile missile launcher




I left this for last as it will take the longest time to complete just in case I don't make the cut off date for the DLC models, we can use it for the next promotional date which is about every 18 weeks. After this update the next will be a cold war vehicles after that outdoor scenery objects, we will be updating the cold war DLC for at least the next year or so.So trying to do as many models as possible in advance so that I can continue my own projects, but the vehicles will likely eat up any time gained.Estimating the grumble will likely take at least a 1 week to model, another couple of days for the normals.
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Posted: 21st Feb 2019 10:06
You desperately need to add more polys into your cylindrical models like the shell casings and the MK39. They look very jagged and noticeable "game-y" if there is such a thing - and I'm talking about circa Quake 3 style. I get that you're concerned about poly count but you seem to be concentrating in the wrong areas. Those latches on the side of the shell casings for example, the latch could be accomplished with a single flat poly with an alpha channel, and the plate underneath could be - as Belidos was suggesting - part of the normal map. Then you've got those circular holes on the plates at the bottom; no player will ever see those in detail so they could easily be 7 or even 5-gon holes. When I'm working with cylinders, I like to use odd numbers so players don't immediately spot the symmetry, e.g. I'll use a 9-sided cylinder over a 10-sided one any day. If you're worried about the cumulative effects of having several of these models in the level, use LODs to keep the count down at distance.

Your sci-fi corridors look fantastic btw!

AE
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Posted: 21st Feb 2019 11:21
I strongly disagree.......mate, while appreciate the feedback.Gameguru isn't Unity nor unreal so the is polygons is going to massively impact the final result, 8 sides is more then enough, don't waste polygons just for the sake of making an object appear more round.It is gameguru after all, I will MUCH MUCH rather have 1000 lower polygon models in a level especially gameguru with it's weak performance in general then only a 100 models.Side panel with handles is 230 polygons, it's low and cheap there is no need to paint normals for 12 odd polygons.That is nitpicking for the sake of nitpicking.

With ULC loader means an additional 2500 polygons for what, so it appears more round, seriously ? I export directly to DBO, I do not work with X file format period, I haven't used it in over a year, only exception is when animating objects.So LOD isn't practical when exporting directly to DBO for me.

So the drawback is no LOD, going nuts for LOD for small objects to what end. I don't waste my time on small objects and LOD, there is no need for it..LOD is practical for large objects that can be viewed some distances.

No offense intended, it's what is pre approved with Lee during the development stage, I tell him exactly how many polygons and what models will be made.I feel it's nitpicking for the sake of nitpicking.







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Avenging Eagle
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Posted: 21st Feb 2019 13:51 Edited at: 21st Feb 2019 13:52
I didn't mean to offend you, so if I have, I apologise. It's just that your previous post was all about how you would have liked to reduce the poly count further. From what I could see, the obvious place is in the little details...like those side panels with handles.

Quote: "Side panel with handles is 230 polygons"


All I was saying was you could, if you wanted, economise a bit on the parts of the model that will only ever occupy a few pixels of screen space. You wouldn't put a 4K texture on something the size of a cigarette packet in-game, so why devote 230 polygons x 8 to something that will be practically indistinguishable from something lower poly.

Or, to put it another way, yes it is nitpicking to agonise over the polycount on such a small bit of the model, you might only save 50 polygons, but every poly you save could then be spent making those cylinders look less like Smartie tubes

Didn't realise you work in DBO directly, I now understand why LOD is not an option for you. I think the jury is still out on the merits of LOD. I like using it, I've only just learned how to, but what you gain in performance due to drawing fewer polygons you lose in memory having to load the LODs in the first place. I'm still experimenting.

Anyway, like I said, no offence intended, it's just one artist's subjective view of another (highly-respected) artist's work.

AE

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