Product Chat / Thanks goes out to BOTR

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MK83
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Posted: 9th May 2016 17:22 Edited at: 9th May 2016 17:28
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Thanks for the amazing tuts on how to get characters into Guru.
Question for the forum: In the pic attached, there are just 4
characters and nothing else in the map. Why is the fps so low?
Stock characters have high fps.
My specs are listed below. Any help is appreciated.
AMD Phenom x4 9850 2.58 Ghz , 6 gb ram, 2GB EVGA Geforce GTX 750, Win 10 x64



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Belidos
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Posted: 9th May 2016 17:27 Edited at: 9th May 2016 17:28
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I assume they're mixamo characters right?

What type of rig did you choose for them (two finger, three finger or full)?

It's recommended to rig a maximum of 63 bones to a rig for gameguru and I think the full rig exceeds that, I've found that if you rig them with a full rig (ie 5 fingers with three joints each, 5 toes and so on) it really eats the FPS.

I use the two finger rigs, they're more than enough for what we're doing in gameguru and to be honest you don't really notice a huge difference.

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MK83
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Posted: 9th May 2016 17:30
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Quote: "I assume they're mixamo characters right? "


Two are Mixamo and two are FPSC X10
as for rigging, I followed BOTR's tuts for Importing Mixamo characters.
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MK83
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Posted: 9th May 2016 17:36
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Quote: "I use the two finger rigs, they're more than enough for what we're doing in gameguru and to be honest you don't really notice a huge difference."
So I should just delete the extra bones?
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Belidos
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Posted: 9th May 2016 17:40 Edited at: 9th May 2016 17:48
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He didn't really go through the actual initial rigging in his videos, just said to download them from mixamo, and then how to adjust it to biped.

I think some of the characters you can get from there have full rigs, you can re-rig it before downloading it by selecting it then clicking the orange edit rig button, at the bottom of the preview that loads up is a drop down menu to choose the rig type.

I'm not saying this is definitely the issue, but it's cause low fps for me when I've used full rig characters from mixamo.

No idea about the FPSC ones, try placing them one at a time and see which one cause the most fps drop, it might just be the mixamo ones, or it might be the FPSC ones, in which case I have no idea.

EDIT: I've a feeling it could be the one on the left, it has extra parts like the swords etc, usually those types of characters are rigged with extra bones for those parts and gameguru doesn't play nice with characters with extra bones, the winged demon is a good example, it really eats the FPS because of the extra wing bones.

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Posted: 9th May 2016 17:46 Edited at: 9th May 2016 17:47
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Quote: "So I should just delete the extra bones?"


Deleting the extra bones probably won't work as they have vertices assigned to them so if you remove them it will warp the mesh, if you wanted to reduce the bones it would be best to do it in mixamo.

As I said, it's not 100% that this is your problem, it's just something I've found effects fps for me, it might be something completely different for you.

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Posted: 9th May 2016 17:58 Edited at: 9th May 2016 18:06
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@Belidos, thanks I will try and see.

Edit: Okay I tried the characters individually.
Any one character drops the fps to between 30 and 60
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 9th May 2016 18:28
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Hi guys, mixamo characters there is no rigging to do as they already rigged on the site unless I'm misunderstanding somewhere
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Posted: 9th May 2016 19:00
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Quote: "Hi guys, mixamo characters there is no rigging to do as they already rigged on the site unless I'm misunderstanding somewhere"


I thought the same thing.
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Belidos
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Posted: 9th May 2016 20:22 Edited at: 9th May 2016 20:25
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Quote: "Hi guys, mixamo characters there is no rigging to do as they already rigged on the site unless I'm misunderstanding somewhere "


Yes you are misunderstanding somewhere

The stock characters have been rigged already, yes, however when you upload to the site you get a dialogue that asks you to choose how to rig them. You get a choice of standard (65 bones), three chain fingers (49 bones), two chain fingers (45 bones), and no fingers (25 bones). The stock characters are generally saved as standard (65 bones) which is two more than the recommended 63 if (I remember correctly) for GameGuru.

You can change this on the stock characters by clicking on them in mixamo to view them in the 3D view pane, then on the right hand side you will see a button that says "edit rigging".



From what I've seen so far, the more bones a model has the more it effects the FPS in GameGuru, and considering you really don't need all the extra finger joints i'd recommend using the 2 chain finger rig.

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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 9th May 2016 20:46
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oh yes there is that if you are uploading from fuse, then you can choose the rig setup.
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Posted: 9th May 2016 20:47
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Yup, you can also choose which one to use on the stock models too, that's what I was trying to say

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Posted: 10th May 2016 19:24 Edited at: 10th May 2016 19:30
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Thank you, thank you, thank you, BOTR! I got my first Fuse character in thanks to you! BTW, your videos are private again! I think I got it down though, now. My guy doesn't really do much yet, I just put in a couple basic animations (walk/run) and used the ai_cover script. But he more or less follows me around like a wagon salesman should! Thanks again!



EDIT: Sorry for the poor quality, I guess that's what happens when you compress it from 100+MB to 4!
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Posted: 10th May 2016 19:42
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Quote: "Thank you, thank you, thank you, BOTR! "


Yup, Bored of the Rings is one of my top five favourite community members. These videos of his have really upped my game and i'm much more confident creating characters now

Thank you Mike, you're awesome!

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MK83
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Posted: 10th May 2016 19:48
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Lets not forget seg welder and weapon welder too, he's absolutely
a very valued forum member in my book.
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 10th May 2016 19:49
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thanks guys-no problem at all with the vids, glad they were of some help.
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Belidos
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Posted: 10th May 2016 19:55
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Quote: "Lets not forget seg welder and weapon welder too, he's absolutely
a very valued forum member in my book. "


Yup definitely, somebody give the man a Valued Member badge!

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Posted: 10th May 2016 20:08
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Quote: " somebody give the man a Valued Member badge! "


He's got my vote! This opens up an almost unlimited supply of characters. Priceless!
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Posted: 10th May 2016 20:57
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thanks guys, no need for a badge, as a community we are all stars.
I had a PM today asking how to get FPSC characters into GameGuru and in particular model pack 20 (dwarfs, warriors, knights etc). I did a very short video which only shows the basics (more for beginners) but will add more videos for more complex tasks at later date as characters can go through various processes depending on what your goals are. I'll upload as soon as possible.

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Posted: 10th May 2016 22:22
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Quote: "thanks guys, no need for a badge, as a community we are all stars."


Perhaps, but there are always some stars that are more brilliant than others! Now if we could just get the limit on polygons lifted a bit. Some of the characters I've created will not work. They go into the importer well enough, but not into the editor. Why are we limited to 22000? Is it a limitation of the .dbo? From what I understand, the Directx 9 allows for 65000 or thereabout.
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Posted: 11th May 2016 02:02
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In the original posters screen shots the models have more draw calls then the default
characters. More draw calls equals lower frame rates.
If you are exporting from Fragmotion as an X file, uncheck the box for export groups.
If you leave it checked it will export groups as limbs and every limb is a draw call.
For a character model you do not need limbs because generally characters are one mesh
rigged with bones. The default masked shoulder has less draw calls because he has no limbs.
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Posted: 11th May 2016 02:14
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Badge issued. Thank you Bored of the Rings.
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Posted: 11th May 2016 05:50
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many thanks for the badge and to all that supported me on the forums, very much appreciated .

The video below is more for beginners and doesn't go into skeleton rigging or any complicated processes, it just shows how to get a basic FPSC (model pack 20 as requested by one user) into GameGuru without coming out disfigured/saggy and how to alter the FPE. So if you're advanced, you may not find this useful.

If anyone wants more Animer based video tuts, please let me know and I'll try and find time to record more, although Animer does come with some links to videos in the PDF file which I found very useful.

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Posted: 11th May 2016 05:53
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You are welcome, Well deserved.
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Posted: 11th May 2016 07:06
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@STab In The Dark Software-thanks for the tip-I'll uncheck groups in FM and see what happens
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Posted: 11th May 2016 11:34
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Congrats on your badge ...As Myke and many other state its well earned
The only person ever to get all his work done by "Friday" was Robinson Crusoe..
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Posted: 11th May 2016 12:21
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Hi all, videos no longer private, sorry about that. I was making some of the old ones private as they not that good ha and must have made some of the newer ones private by mistake as I was half asleep while making the changes... sorry all have now put em all back to public doh!
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Posted: 11th May 2016 12:31
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Quote: "thanks guys, no need for a badge, as a community we are all stars."


You're like me, I haven't even bothered emailing Lee to get the reviewer badge, I just don't feel I need recognition for the things I do to help out, I'm just happy to help, all the reward I need is to know I helped others.

However, now and again someone comes along who really deserves recognition and you're one of those people. Graz on your badge.

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Posted: 11th May 2016 14:30
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@Belidos you have been badged.
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Posted: 11th May 2016 14:40
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Quote: "In the original posters screen shots the models have more draw calls then the default
characters. More draw calls equals lower frame rates.
If you are exporting from Fragmotion as an X file, uncheck the box for export groups.
If you leave it checked it will export groups as limbs and every limb is a draw call.
For a character model you do not need limbs because generally characters are one mesh
rigged with bones. The default masked shoulder has less draw calls because he has no limbs."


Thanks, I will try.
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MK83
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Posted: 11th May 2016 14:41
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Quote: "Badge issued. Thank you Bored of the Rings."

Awesome. well deserved.
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MK83
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Posted: 11th May 2016 15:34 Edited at: 11th May 2016 15:35
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Quote: "If you are exporting from Fragmotion as an X file, uncheck the box for export groups."

No real difference. First is before and second is after I unchecked the box.
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Bored of the Rings
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Posted: 11th May 2016 17:53
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I also had the same results, not much difference to be honest, but will keep it in mind for future model exports.
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