I am not saying you were lying or intentionally misleading, but there was a HUGE discrepancy between what the product was capable of and customers, press, your promotion partners like Nivida and retailers selling it, thought it was capable of. And those 3rd parties also heavily miscommunicated the capabilities. I remember when German Magazine Gamestar featured the demo with



and then had to deal with people calling them liars.

I am pretty sure you were aware of some communication issues, too, at least your own disclaimer points toward that direction.
My biggest complain was that you couldn't actually roll out games with X10 that would run on more than the top 0,1% of the PC population back then and even years after. We had a "machine from hell" at JoWooD, with two 8800GTX inside, capable of running unoptimized Arcania Code fluently for press previews, but with two corridors and 8 Rooms each in X10, it went to its knees.



This is something I fully understand, however, first would be getting the sales up, and then, if it doesnt work, scaling the team down. I will happily consult you on doing so, and even do that for free (several big gaming companies are paying me exactly for that, you know...). A good starting point is converting your wish list potential customers to purchasing ones, which isn't that hard to achieve. But you are right, with the changes in the visibility, Steam Store is even harder to work with in order to get decent revenues. As said, I can help there.

I am not unsatisfied with the TGC output over the years. You know I bought almost every single product and expansion your company released, and made games with them that are more successful than anything else Austrian Indie devs produce for a core gamer PC audience. Just two hours I ago I got the notification that Father's Island won its second Game of the Year award, so I would be quite stupid bashing GameGuru, wouldn't I?

But there are core feature needs that would make great material for agressive update communication you should tackle first. I am relieved that MyWorld has nothing to do with you, but the roadmap for the next GG updates should also have marketign / PR / sales in mind.

@ Lee .

just like i said, here is a lot off skilled users out here that will gladly help you.
make use of it. We understand that you can not do everything on your own. make use of these talent,
get the core issues sorted out, get rid of the voting board and fix what need to be fix.
Things like,
what Teabone said:
AI To Navigate Stairs
Adjustable Water Height
Swimming
More Terrain Texture Painting Option
Particle System

Thanks

I read this a lot, 'get rid of the voting board' but it provides a schedule, a list to work through for the development of GG.
A list which consists of features needed and wanted by the users of GG, above all, ordened through a voting system.
Who are we to neglect this? why should we have the right to say that Lee should drop the voting board and neglect the many users who are not active on this community forum?

Noone has said to drop it entirely. But there is a huge difference between mandatory fixes / core features and feature requests / wish list items from the community.

If all current features and those promised in the original FPSC-Reloaded Kickstarter and later private pledging system are implemented (and perhaps some from the voting list along the way if that happens to be practical), the votign board does have some sense.

I've been spending the last 3 years doing work-arounds with GG/Reloaded due to missing functions and features.

The items I desperately need are listed in my previous post. Unfortunately most of them are so far below on the list I may have to wait till 2018. The particle system is still semi-hard-coded and can only process smoke with no birth and death rate modifications. I've alternatively had to stick with layering decals (an old Playstation 2 trick):



I've now reached a point where I need to modify the water and have the ability for the player to swim. So again I have to look into work around. Its currently impossible to raise and lower water. So if your map is too high up above the water and you spent weeks on the map. You are screwed if you want there to be any lakebeds, oceans or rivers. Its been a struggle but but the only way to get past this is to start over or look at creating a water plain as entity. Which is not ideal for many reasons.... Additionally scripting the swimming functionalities is never going to result to anything that good on my part and it leaves too much room for bugs.



The real showstopper for me is my inability to paint more than the limited number of terrain texture units we have. I'm using custom made textures but am very limited to how many can be in a single map. There is no workaround for this.



Interesting enough I'd be very satisfied with Game-Guru if it was able to tackle the hard-hitting requests from the currently active and positive members. Currently I feel my creative expression is a bit restricted with GG. I do have an educated background in Environmental Game Design of which I did take a couple courses for. I am now a volunteer support contact for Bethesda's Creation Kit and GECK engine tools, on their modding forums. There really isn't anything I can't do in their engines. In-regards to GG, I can't really express all that I've learned over the years and really show off what I'm capable of at present, only to an extent. I find with Unity and Unreal the same process of level design works for both engines. But for GG its quite easy to find roadblocks and challenges very early on which require workarounds which might be early show stoppers for newcomers who might be able to problem solve like most of us here. This might explain the recent bad reviews. But we'll see how things go in 2017,

Yes i agree with you both, and what has been stated before, the core engine needs priority before the bling bling.
I have to say that i'm quite content with the two coming updates, EBE and the overhaul of AI, that would greatly improve GG in my opinion, certainly swimming should be possible then?

I've lowered the terrain on one map but that is not really the way to go because it poses a problem on the rim of the map, so the other option is to raise the water level.
But i understand that this cannot be done in the shader?

One thing that i want to say is that i really like to follow the progress you all make with GG, excellent work is being done by so many of you.

Teabone, with the custom textures, do you still have the problem that textures do not blend well as seen in the screenshot below?

My thought is to use textures from other terrain maps so it is less visible.

I didn't read all the posts here, I've just taken a look to the link and I feel totally pranked! After 3 years, Game-Guru is not even on the level FPSC once was and lightyears away of any nowadays game engine and they start a new project instead of finally bringing Game-Guru on a usable level? A shame that I can't get my $ 100 back with what I supported FPSC reloaded/Game-Guru! My good, how pranked I feel! I feel ashamed to be "User of the Month" for a company that treats their customers like this.

Wow. That FPS Creator X10 looks cool. Where can I download that? LOL.

I have FPS Creator X10 still and it runs perfectly in Windows 7. FPS never drops and the models and shaders hold up well to today standard Indie games. Though like wolf mention earlier, a lot of the features in X10 later made their way to X9. For instance you could lower and raise water in both X10 and X9, in test mode and via scripting.

Made this video only a little while ago to show what real-time water features we had in FPSCx10 running on Windows 7:



Here's a video from 10 years ago:



Can't wait till we are able to do the same in GG

Then perhaps you should read it ... I think you jumped the gun a little prematurely here ..


If you had read it then you would know whats going on ..
.

How have you been treated exactly ?

Its been made clear this is Raveys & Adams brainchild ... Nothings changed as far as GameGuru is concerned

Perhaps that is problem!

LOL ..That's actually quite funny

Another good day for Ravey and Adam .. £ 2,085 in total ,,

Do you have any suggestions for TGC how they could pay their bills and wages in future? That's what they need to do if they want continue working on GameGuru.

Well, after watching and chiming in on this thread, and with Lee's reassurance, I am off to back the brainchild of Ravey and Adam.

Not really my kind of thing - I am actually completely addicted to Game Guru, and learning the art of game design - but I know a few of my grandkids will probably enjoy it when it is out so that will be fun playing with them, and if it helps feed Lee and co, and keeps the wheels turning for Game Guru, I am happy to help out.

Here's hoping the EBE is out soon, and Lee can get cracking on more goodness for Game Guru - may 2017 bring us all closer to our goals.

Good luck with the kickstarter Ravey and Alan

Reliquia....

X10 was an unstable and unusable nightmare compared to X9 which was able to deliver way prettier graphics as well.
It may look flashy at first glance but once you get a project going....oh dear!



Well... I'll fix that for ya!



-Wolf

looking at the My World kick-starter demo , shows that what was due to be done in game guru
was probably to good to for release in GG and pushed into another software release,
all the time spent on promised features have been used in
my-world. if you cared about GG and not going into liquidation, you could have had all the features put
into GG by now, but you have spent more time on another kick-starter project, possibly knowing GG engine
will never or cant have the features on the voting list or otherwise, it is an insult to push my-world
development on to another company member you are the CEO, and following the voting list is probably
a convenience to keep the mortgage or bills paid, lack of respect to the community disappearing from the
forums, to swan of on another kick-starter project is not a worthy idea. as for GG or any other project at the moment
you are working on should not be available on steam until TGC can provide a viable option or explanation .
so you can leave or fail in promises you made with the kick-starter demo,s of the other projects people have
purchased, showing a kick-starter demo of my-world, with features that are not even made available in the software
or super imposed ideas that may not be delivered as advertised, i hope steam can take note of the the forum users
and discussions here and on steam forums and not endorse GG or any other project from TGC until you are made
accountable. i do not have the confidence in GG being able to support some of the features promised in the features list.
AI, and a nav system that will be advanced enough for customers needs without massive performance issues.
leading to GG,s demise. we all probably now my-world is aimed at the education market just like the X9 path went but failed
why do it again, there are far to many advanced engines out there that can do better than the new my-world kickstaretr
project and are available now , why dont TGC concentrate on GG and make it worth using, swanning of on holidays every time a DLC
pack is released, or a new project is launched, or simply blaming the community for its failing, forum members leaving.
a sinking ship should make you aware something is now wrong and you have done nothing in a way of apology or to put thing right.
simple fixes held back to keep the wolves at bay when the complain is not the answer. fix or finish this project its unfair and unjust to
string people along for there hard earned cash. the easy build editor is a joke and a convenient time restriction for TGC to swan off
on another kick-starter project, the voting list looks like a convenient place to start perhaps things on the list will be convenient for your timing
on other projects, like the EBE hold up to launch the kick-starter, show us the updates on the EBE and prove me wrong.

Some replies for you:

@Nomad Soul : Yes, I think I was pretty enthusiastic adding those X10 features to the DX10 tech demo, but I think when it came to making a whole game level from them, the performance was pretty stinky which is why they did not make it to the final build. Glad you liked the subsequent FPSC stuff we added (thanks to my modder friends).

@Ertlov : I don't understand how assumptions about X10 made by users and press transform into cast iron promises by TGC? When the product was finally finished, we listed the featues actually available in the final X10 product, and added a disclaimer for those who tried the ealy tech demo to ensure full disclosure. I don't think we did anything bad, we talked about the project and progress in 2008, and I don't think we delivered a bad product (aside from the fact it took two top-end NVIDIA graphics cards to run). I am curious how you would include marketting into future GameGuru plans in 2017 to avoid what you consider bad PR during the X10 development? What practical stuff should I do that is not coding or replying to social messaging? Ideas most welcome.

@PCSKILLER : I like the idea of recruiting community members to help accelerate the development, but how many users actually want to get their hands dirty in deep down code for no wages and little thanks? It's a hard life trying to anticipate and fulfill everyone's needs! Anyone interested in the role, please do post with your skillset and what you might like to help out with.

@Ertlov : Can you enumate the missing core features when you refer to "current features and those promised in the original FPSC-Reloaded Kickstarter and later private pledging system", perhaps with links to where TGC promised them.

@ALL : It would be good to get an overview so we know ALL the things I've promised over the years. If anyone else can add to that list (with a link to remind me what and when I said it as my brain is cheese these days), I will be happy to compile a single list of all CORE features (that may or may not be in the voting board). It will be a useful exercise in addressing many concerns at once.

@Teabone : I appreciate the creativity you're showing to work around the absent features you want in GameGuru. With the skills and capabilities you are showing, it might be an idea to take your assets and try the same game prototype in Unity to see if progress improves. I am the first to acknowledge that GameGuru can act more like an anchor for users who have good coding experience, art and design skills, and I can imagine being frustrated if I was a C++ programmer forced to write games in a drag and drop world. No harm in checking out the competition and popping back sometime in 2017 to see if the features you need have arrived. You might even finish your game before I finish the features

@UNIRD12B & MK83 : Check the last page with my replies to your posts, curious on your feedback. Thanks!

@reliquia : Thanks for helping Ravey with his project, he has high hopes for MyWorld. My advice to him was only pick the best things to work on (80/20 rule) and unlike GameGuru, the product should be very tight and well defined. If I have learned anything over the last decade, it's to manage expectations VERY carefully.

@devlin : I'm not swanning anywhere, I am right here, reading your post Your sentence "blaming the community for its failing...you have done nothing in a way of apology or to put thing right" is pretty strong? Can you send me a link in which I blamed the GameGuru community for my own failings? If I did, I would certainly apologize as that's pretty silly of me to alienate my most valuable resource. As to putting right 'my failings', more updates and features for GameGuru, that's all I know how to do.

@ lee
With the skills and capabilities you are showing, it might be an idea to take your assets and try the same game prototype in Unity to see if progress improves. I am the first to acknowledge that GameGuru can act more like an anchor for users who have good coding experience, art and design skills, and I can imagine being frustrated if I was a C++ programmer forced to write games in a drag and drop world. No harm in checking out the competition and popping back sometime in 2017 to see if the features you need have arrived. You might even finish your game before I finish the features .


I find this so patronizing, this is your insulting, way to get rid of long term members of the community, who have cared for your products.
so many members leaving after spending or keeping TGC products alive. popping back sometime in 2017 yes pref after the september release
of my-world. no this is not a personal attack or rant at you personally lee, but a customer who supports and supported TGC for years, and would
like to see a product with future scope, perhaps we should all choose our words more carefully. not to be misunderstood . i can imagine the pressure
on you at this moment with the feed back on the forums but GG does not seem to have any major direction at the moment, and seeing new products
on the kick-starter, just fuels the the fire, with the community, apart from the voting board, show us or explain what ideas you have for AI or a nav system
or future plans to give the forum members a direction you plan to go with GG, any sort of prototype would be assuring .

@Teabone : Did you think I was being patronizing and insulting, and trying to get rid of you? Why would I get rid of someone who has contributed SO MUCH to the GameGuru community, and continues to do so?

It's important to understand, I am not some supernatural entity, sent to earth to annoy everyone. I've been making games and game makers since I was 9 years old, it's my main passion in life, and I found a way to create software I would like to make and sell it to others for a living. It was by accident I discovered others also liked the software I liked, so I made more of them. At what point did I turn into what appears to be a self-serving, patronizing, insulting and generally horrible individual?

TGC are not a charity that struggles from release to release. https://companycheck.co.uk/company/03738984/THE-GAME-CREATORS-LTD/financials




Couldn't agree more. For example, create a terrain using the random feature and discover that you have no control over the height of the water plane.

In my opinion, never



I agree on that! You did nothing wrong or "bad", but you lacked the "Expectation Management" part of pre-release PR. Which brings me to:



They don't - but it is a quite critical aspect of pre-release work to have a keen eye on those expectations and assumptions popping up all over the place and adressing them properly. Take a look at No Man's Sky to learn their bitter lesson what a worst case scenario regarding such assumptions can trigger.



- No coding, sorry, but...
- Marketing
- PR (including giving you access to my worldwide press contact database)
- Sound design & sound assets creation
(up to 8 hours per week total)



Get an overview over your current Wishlist balance on Steam
Know that a good (!) announcement covnerts 2 - 5 % of your current balance to actual sales, and adds new wishlist entries (but less than converted)
Know that a good announcement, combined with a week-long-deal scheduled via Steamworks and some Social Media / Press work, can convert 10 - 35% of your wishlist balance to actual purchases.
Good announcements would always (!) include Screenshots or a video clip showing either
Current development progress, in best case a "before - after" video (no matter if editor features, shaders, AI behaviour or simply FPS count going through the roof) OR
Short best-of clips from current or released GG games that really kick in (here perhaps with a disclaimer "you need basic LUA skills / texturing knowledge / 200 hours to achieve similar results", you know, EXPECTATION MANAGEMENT) OR
A personal, short message, adressing the community via video and talking about the next steps

Those announcement should also heavily be pushed over

Facebook
Twitter
Instagram (No kidding! Screenshots or short videos pushed to Instagram can generate quite some buzz!)
Here (of course)
IndieDB (because of the amount of starting devs there

That's it for a start, please ping me via Skype or email if you want help or more details on that.

None of those things. I've been around for quite some time and have said I'll always remain in the community to support everyone, no matter what happens. Rolfy had similar sentiments before he moved to Unity. Says he'll still be an active member here, make contributions and check back on the progress. My programming skills are not very good at all and its one of the reasons why software like FPSC and Game Guru fits me well. As I stated in this thread earlier there are only but a few things that are barriers and challenges for me. But on the plus side, they are on an actual list now (the feature voting list). Whereas a few years ago it was more kind of up in the air situation, with a lot of uncertainty.

I feel I should apologize when I bring up Unity and Unreal. If i were to take the full dive into anything else I would not be able to achieve the same results without gathering a team to cover programming. My skill-sets there are only in one small aspect of game development, so I'd be taking on more than I can chew with any other software. You've been able to to create something for us that we believe in so strongly, we get maybe too overly passionate about it. Loose our minds when we don't hear from anyone, or feel any sense of uncertainty. Kind of like PTSD from some past experiences. I do apologize for that as well.

I can't say I share the same opinions as devlin and UNIRD12B in this thread. Your response here has been more than relieving. I find it remarkable what you have been able to create for us to create. Will always support you. I just need to take a chill pill

We wish you a Merry Christmas;
We wish you a Merry Christmas;
We wish you a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.
Good tidings we bring to you and your kin;
Good tidings for Christmas and a Happy New Year.

Oh, bring us a figgy pudding;
Oh, bring us a figgy pudding;
Oh, bring us a figgy pudding and a cup of good cheer
We won't go until we get some;
We won't go until we get some;
We won't go until we get some, so bring some out here

We wish you a Merry Christmas;
We wish you a Merry Christmas;
We wish you a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.

cmon guys tis the season to be jolly

its good that people are so passionate about GG this means TGC are doing something right we all care about it otherwise threads like this would not happen.

wish I could model and render properly would have put a Christmas tree here lol

Cartoon Xmas Models

LOL thank you Belidos

I should also mention, I do intent to back MyWorld In January (funds are always low during the holiday season)

Looks like another game engine "GameGuru" for the trash can, and you can actually mark your calendar when the NExT all wonderful game making software will me splashed across a web page. 27 months max.

Well, this is very constructive way to spread negativity, but based on what?
Is it not possible to add constructive substance like constructive criticism?

I don't played around much with FPSC9.... but I reed much in the TGC Forums. When I read it right, the users had the chance to get their hand on the code and made great things like own shaders and other. Why sould it be other with GG, if there is a chance to get the hands on?

My Experiance with 3D programming is low and mostly a java thing. But I'm sure that some like me will try to help.
Today it is normal for really much peoples to get everything in ready state and at best for free. So it's a VERY good sign that this community asks for chances to help. Use it .
At the end it's still your descesion what goes official in GG. So what can happen? Perhaps just that a great product will be more great in shorter time. This community has proven their creativity in making games and finding workarounds for missing things. Lee, I remember that you write over the LUA thing you don't expected what grat big things users would do with it. Perhaps you get suprised in a positive way again.

Another as stated by many others, half baked piece of software, maybe if we could put them all into ONE program, we would have something. Is it just me or has anyone else noticed in the FPSC days there were thousands and thousands of posts to the forums, then AGK and Donkey? then reloaded and the school all wonderful game making software. now the non existent Gameguru with a few forum members.

First person that comes to mind is " Smallg " I would use and abuse this mans scripting skills
If he's going to make all these scripts for the community free then why not request some made to order for the core of GameGuru....
Perhaps his name on the scripting credits or something would suffice

FOUND IT !!

https://youtu.be/qCUUw2PRxh0

YES! YES AND YES!

Lee already knows my skill set. I could add to GG....

Vehicle physics.(All types)
Automatic Convex hull decomposition for concave collision shapes.
Offset center of mass for physics objects.
A complete physics destruction system that can automatically fracture all objects.
Integrate Recast and Detour to work with the physics character controller for multilevel AI.

But just like TGC I can not work for free.

Those of us who spend a lot of time with (and enjoy) GameGuru were fairly dismayed that another product may be permanently taking away Lee from further enhancement and support of GameGuru.

I'd come to the conclusion that if GG release delays this year were needed to support other TGC initiatives then that's OK - we have to live in the real world sometimes - but if support was to end then I'd move on from this product. I'd be upset after all the hours invested and a bit sad, but hey it's not worth any savagery and vitriol (it's a game maker/engine!), and I'd learnt masses from the product and this community, which I'd still have.

And now that Lee has confimed GG support - I'm really OK now - progress has been much slower than expected in 2016, but I still see people having a lot of fun and expending energy with GG, asking for more fixes and features and being supportive despite frustrations with voting board and release speed.

I also see a lot of people ranting ... totally understand the reasons why (everyone has their favourite feature requests and challenges for what they want to to achieve with GG) and differing history with other TGC products.

Howver, I don't really understand some of the snarling and gnashing of teeth tone of the comments - all these will do (unless they also make the authors feel a little better in themselves perhaps?) is to be hurtful to Lee and others in TGC who read them. To a big company this type of approach does nothing but hit front-line support staff and makes no difference to their business, to a small company it's depresssing to their morale and can effect their bottom line quickly.

I'd urge people to stay positive and be constructive with their feedback - please

For me over the years, Lee has been nothing except courteous and helpful - doing the best he can to make software people want to have. I envy him in that he is doing a job he is passionate about (hopefully he still is after this thread) and thank him for the support.

Cheers everyone - enjoy the holiday season.

Ye that kind of justifies Lee's point .... And that's fair enough .. However its surprising how many would ...
I'm around doing this just about 24/7 just for the love of it ...... I wish I had the ability to do more on the technical side of things

I wanted to chime in here but cybernescence pretty much said what I wanted to. Okay, I'll add my two cents. GG and Lee aren't going anywhere. I, too, was upset about this new product initially, and that was in another thread about a month or so ago. I realize GG is an unfinished product, but what engine is complete? I don't know of one (if anyone does, let me know; I'd love to try it!). I think the lack of communication the past 4 or 5 months put many of us on edge, and I believe what mostly slowed down development this year was the dreaded EBE. Those of us still hanging around in 2017 will just have see what comes about! Happy/Merry Christmas to all!

Keep fighting the good fight, Lee.

If I may elaborate a little on what's been said here...

As Ertlov has stressed and you have acknowledged, managing expectations is incredibly important. I think it's important to realize that although TGC produces software, you lot excel at selling dreams.



On stuff like this, the difference between using a word like "pursue" in lieu of "fulfill" is massive.

While it's impossible to manage the dreams of others, you can evaluate the checkboxes on offer a bit more realistically. For example, if you claim to enable a user to easily make FPS games then then the basic output should be in line with what is considered acceptable in a contemporary FPS game. Basics like bullet hole decals or vertical gameplay (upper floor AI) should be expected. In lieu of AI and all the accompanying issues, it would have been great to have seen multiplayer developed into a more usable state but that too comes lacking with narrow gameplay archetypes and ease of client-side cheating. There should also be basic functionality of a complete "game" whatever the genre with simple things like proper menus for built games with resolution, graphics, keybindings and other expected settings. An end user shouldn't be expected to navigate a .ini for those sorts of things these days.

As a general observation, I would like to say that there seems to be somewhat of a disconnect between the software's focus/marketing and the forum community. The marketing (and perhaps performance/capability targeting) seem to be aimed at very young users. However, this community is relatively mature. There are a lot of grandparents in here! Hardly any of us are children. Are we using the wrong software? When TGC closes their collective eyes and envisions their target user, who do they see? I'll always cherish my FPSC time because the software allowed me to improve my game art/design skills without needing to learn to code. It makes me super sad to think that I'm not meant to be able to continue to grow with Game Guru.

One other thing I want to touch on is the concept of community blaming that was brought up. In a very indirect way, this is happening. How so? The voting board. When major engine improvements or sometimes fairly basic fixes are waylaid, we are often referred to the voting board. The voting board is it's own kind of tyranny... a spectre of the whims of users come and gone. I've always felt the voting board has been a bit like asking a four year old if they would rather go to Disneyland or to University. The casual voter has no regard for the big picture. They only see what they want in that moment. I propose that Voting board be reset every six months (or however long arbitrary amount of time) and that it not be such a heavy factor in development flow. Lee should be able to get the general gist of things people want and plan accordingly in a way that the core engine is the primary focus. He knows best what is needed for the long term success of the platform and I can't help but think that the voting board is a constant adversary for him. Honestly, many of us have been around since the beginning and wouldn't have at all minded a six month feature hiatus in exchange for a dx upgrade or similar core enhancement/evolution.

I'll shut up for now. Don't let the man/pitchfork mobs get ya down

*Mod Edit* - while comparisons can be useful this thread is only for discussing TGC products.

@ synchromesh

this is more fitting than Basil Fawlty
prob more up your street.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgFlbgwWf94

@Devlin ....

OH WOW ... Been looking for that one
J/K

@Lee I would like to retract my statement. And, apologize, I quoted before thinking it through. I loved FPSC, x10, Dark basic studio, and Guru.
I guess I'm just anxious about wishing Guru was further along than it is. ie: DX 11,lighting, AI, better inside building abilities. Your doing
a wonderful job for one man. You said that your not a supernatural being, that's true and we should all remember that. Your a talented
programmer that spends most of his time trying to please so many. Take your time and do your best. Don't get to stressed out.

Too bad GG doesn't accept add on DLL's . That would solve a few problems (and add a few more (complaints probably )) ). We could have GG Basic and GG PRO .
I am willing to purchase add on DLL's . FPSC had several add on DLL's . I believe Dark AI was one (it's already included in GG now ) .

Lance

Hi Lee,
I really don't know how to put this without it coming across as yet another rant so taking my time with it and not merely typing my thoughts as they pop into my head.

All of the venting by loyal and long term users is down to one thing.....your absence, and even if it is justified from a business point of view by TGC it is still apparent and no amount of posting now will fix this. Since you announced the start of work on the EBE there has been absolutely nothing on progress of this, which is seen by many to be something they don't actually want or require. I know for you this is something you really wanted to get off the ground and you have had big ideas for it for a long time now. Problem is you threw a bone months ago and even now you are here posting nothing about it or how far on you have gone with it. This is leading to the responses you are seeing above, where forum members who just want it out of the way so they can see you move on to the things they really want in the engine are feeling a little strung out with what they see as you sidestepping or even ignoring any questions about it. Someone even directly asked you to show progress and you addressed every part of their post but that part.

I am not trying to add fuel to the flames already being raised in this thread but pointing out how you are doing exactly the opposite as ertlov advises with marketing and managing user expectations wisely. I fully understand how you are caught between a rock and a hard place and how overwhelming it can be when torn between many different projects in a small business with many big and exciting ideas and products to manage, your own analogy is spinning plates
If you keep it up you may actually be heading for a meltdown, I suggest you sit back and take a small break over the holiday season to recharge and come at it fresh after New Year and I suggest we users do the same.

Have a Merry Christmas and an awesome New Year

Good point - psychological breakdowns are quite common with indie developers, as you not only have to deal with normal business stress, but anger and vitriol is directed at the individual, rather than at the company, making it an extremely stressful job. I reckon Sean Murray (No Man's Sky) must have had a good few sessions on the couch to help deal with the fallout and hatred generated by the disappointment with the No Man's Sky release.
As Rolfy suggests, it's probably a good idea to take a break over the next few weeks, maybe work off those frustrations by blowing the virtual crap out of bad guys in the game of your choice (Steam holiday sale starts tomorrow, by the looks of things), and come back refreshed next year.

Reading through the comments, this Thread has gone wildly off topic! Lots of valid points from Consumers and Developers, but you have taken the focus away from a new exciting project.

The comments look like people feel they have lost something as a result of a part of the development team undertaking a new project, but don't forget about what you already have, and what is still to come from GG.

C'mon guys, get a grip, it's a new project not the end of the world!!!!