Here ya go. .

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1247290/GameGuru_MAX/

UNIRD12B

Nice, I see the storage requirements are high (20Gb) I'm guessing a lot of free assets to get people started?

@Tarkus1971
Mostly Character Creator...
Some VR,
MP?

They might want to make it very clear that the MP elements will not support custom assets. This is going to be a huge selling point stating that it has multiplayer support with Photon servers. The automatic assumption will be that they can make their own multiplayer game with their own assets. Just a thought.

Now , that , Is a very important point...how can we make a specific multiplayer
game , the way we want it to look and feel if we can ONLY use stock items ??????

And.....PHOTON MP could end up costing a small fortune to run if your game becomes a good seller or popular to multi play...
It's only FREE in a limited way.

https://www.photonengine.com/en-US/Realtime/pricing

is that not true ?....

Unird12b

It would be nice if we could pre-order through steam, i have no cvc number so i can't buy from the store, nore pre-order from TGC.

@Earthling 45
Can you not possibly use PayPal ?

Unird12b

Why only stock assets for multiplayer? Did I miss something? Custom scripts will apparently work in Max multiplayer.

yes, Smallg...good question....

@Teabone , why do you say that about MP ?

Unird12b

quote... and which is the problem to have a multiplayer game with custom assets???.. only TGC can find and have proble mlike these...i never seen n gmae that cannot use custom media.... it's a shame... another step backward for TGC

Well ,
Let's wait and see if Teabone can explain where he saw that info first...
then we can see....

Unird12b

It was stated on the discord channel that MAX multiplayer will not support custom models or scripts.
It is basically what you have now but uses photon instead of steam....

OldFlak....

Not according to Lee, he stated in one of his answer sessions that custom media will not be supported, he said it would be the same multiplayer system we have now, but hosted on photon and not steam so we can access them without gameguru

Also..
Photon = No Steam dependence, so you can save a Multiplayer Standalone and your friends can run and play your multiplayer level

ok sooooo ..........
lemme see if i can get this straight.......

I can build a game using all kinds of my own models
and NPC's and such and get it personalized just to the
way I want to see it and play it......AND THEN.......
I CANT play it online in Multiplayer mode with anyone?

And...if i play just a game built with stock media I CAN play it online
BUT...if the server gets very popular PHOTON will start to charge me for server usage ?

is it just me........or.........is this starting to look like we are being served up yesterdays fish ?

HELP................ Explanations please !

UNIRD12B

sorry, but that makes really no sense.
a MP only with the stock assets? LOL....
maybe its better to remove the MP part completly from GGMax

I'm assuming that stock media only for multiplayer will be for the first iterations of GGM. I'm sure it will be worked on somewhere down the line?

Guys, I guess you miss a bit the logical dependencies here. If there is any hard limit towards "stock models only" that means either this is enforced in the design (editor) phase already or there is no stand alone multiplayer.

Now, the store page states clearly:

* Photon for standalone multiplayer support

So either for whatever dubious reasons you are limited to stock models only in the editor, or you can use custom assets.

The idea that you are limited to stock assets is probably down to the requirement of owning GameGuru to play together as it is now. I never understood that limitation either since Steam has a huge amount of multiplayer games that don't require the design product unless the server architecture was intentionally built that way by the developer. If you owned the game you have the assets...no different from a built GG standalone given freely. Even Reloaded wasn't limited this way since the creator would host the game themselves, FPSC worked the same way without limitations, with the lack of confirmation it is confusing and maybe the developers themselves aren't sure what they intend to implement or change with MP but it probably did help with sales in the past.
All you as a user should be required to do is take care of hosting dedicated servers yourself and not be limited to assets.
All iterations of multiplayer features are doable with Photon but you need to create and bolt on the appropriate plug ins to use them.

Yeah this.....if what you got to go on is the current GG developer set up then I don't blame them for thinking the same thing will apply and it does look like that is exactly what is going to happen with MP in future.

If that is kept, the "standalone multiplayer support" is a misleading statement bordering on outright lie. I dont believe TGC could afford that.
My best guess is that the "stock assets only" is wrong.

But only Lee can tell.

Yep, should have mentioned that Steam has nothing to do with GameGuru standalone MP dependencies, nor does Photon. This has been an exclusive quirk unique to GameGuru which was categorized as a 'game' initially on Steam. Not sure that has anything to do with it but...well maybe. The mere fact you don't need to install Unity/Unreal to play multiplayer games should make it obvious Steam has nothing to do with these limitations.

I assume he just meant it won't support custom multiplayer at launch as there's a lot of stuff to add to bring the commands up to date.

The reason steam didn't work correctly for multiplayer is because there's no "client" so everyone had to have the same exact version of GG to work together, thus just using stock assets was the solution as you can't expect your players to buy GG and all your assets just to play your game... With Photon you will be the one giving the client to others so they will all be the same.

When and how long it will take to get a good custom multiplayer update is anyone's guess though, it's very likely the system will stay the same as the old one for a long time still (in terms of functionality) - depends how many new commands are exposed to allow custom scripts (Max has a long time left on it's development)

Actually, it has, but it took my brain also a while to figure it out. Steam was used for Multiplayer, but the Steam multiplayer game created with GG was always Gameguru, not the (non-existent) StandAlone. So it had (has) towards the Steam SDK Multiplayer component always the AppID of GameGuru. You never played [YOURGAMENAME] in Multiplayer, but always GameGuru itself with your "Game" simply being the map / level. This kicked in the requirement for joining players having GameGuru themselves (and I bet on the same version, too).

It kicked also in the requirement of "stock assets only" for two reasons:

1. A system detecting which files the joining player has and which need to be transferred is quite sophisticated MP code, and with the Map sizes involves would have triggered Gigabytes of Traffic in a single game.
2. Legal & ownership reasons: Such a system would have transferred all assets towards the joining players, for reason above GameGuru owners themselves. Any self-made, bought or DLC content would have been - at least temporarily - on the joinings player hard drive. Even if you add a clever deletion routine, that`s a legal booby trap.

So, if Max can actually create Stand Alone Multiplayer, custom assets must be of course supported unless they trigger behaviour that cannot be MP synched with the netcode. Own static entities, textures, terrain etc must be possible.

If I am not reading this incorrectly forgive me but in GG you can use custom assets in MP. the other player does not need to own or buy them.
It was only custom scripts we could not use. Custom Assets are stored on the steam workshop.
How or even if this can be possible in Max though I have no idea.

Custom scripts/ models would be a pretty huge deal- to allow flexibility
and creativity. But it's always fun to shoot at bloody zombies! lol

With scripts you could have a ton of new features. I wonder if even the
new MPlayer MAX will support the new CCreator MAX??

Perhaps a better way to say it would be that Steam are not responsible for the way GG Multiplayer is set up. As I said in another thread I only ever created one MP map and was way back in Reloaded where you hosted the game yourself, never had the pleasure of trying the GameGuru version. It was true back then that you could use custom media and custom scripts were not allowed.
I had no idea that GameGuru was limited to stock media on Steam or if it actually even is, I thought it just required the engine to be owned by players and it explains the lack of interest in it over recent years if true.
Where I am getting confused with this is the idea that switching to Photon will make any difference when Steam should be fine with Standalone just as easily, maybe tech reasons I wouldn't know for sure.

Could be that all the nuts and bolts to build MP games with functionality for Photon are more easily integrated.

Its a bit weird that Max multiplayer will only support 8 players tbh, If the code is there from fpsc to host multiplayer locally why wasn't that method used? Then it would only have been limited buy the power of the hosts machine? As most of us know most modern pc's can easily handle 8 players, e.g I hosted local multiplayer Empyrion on an old dual core machine and had no problems with 20 odd players on testing. This was why when asking for multiplayer in GG a while back I posted we needed a locally hosted GG multiplayer .exe with maybe a chat box and a lobby system. Now I don't know tbh what Photon can handle but if it just 8 players its not really any better than the old system so why wasn't that just added instead? Was the multiplayer code not owned by TGC or something? Also Torque3d still has this system and is open source now so maybe even having a look at how they did it could be of use. just a thought.

I think it's more to keep the potential server costs down.
A free Proton acct. Allows up to 20 players and a certain amount of bandwidth.

https://www.photonengine.com/en-US/Realtime/pricing

Unird12b

That's fair enough but wouldn't it have been better to have a locally hosted option? e.g free forever (as its hosted by our own machines) no cap etc etc this is the model adapted by quite a few of the engines. I'm not slating the Photon idea I'm just wondering why this method wasn't adopted as there are far less restrictions, I presume all the code for it is still there. Would be a nice option to have it if its possible.

Ah yes, sorry it's been a long time since I tried MP and it never worked well for me, either way the custom scripts require more communication between the server and clients then was possible and so we will have to see what changes come with Photon