Any reason why there is no scripting request section? I ask this because every time I go to the scripting section I feel like such a jerk since I don't know if the amount of research I have done is enough before looking for help. I'm just not wired to understand the complexities of scripting just as some can't grasp 3d modeling or even composing music. It's the only board that specifically states that it's not a request board, but that leaves those like myself at a complete loss to get our less vanilla ideas across. I know we had at one point animosity towards people that would come to the FPSC forums and just start requesting models and media, but that has been alleviated by the free models and media board where now experienced modelers can give if they want and newer modelers can cut their teeth and get experience with random request strengthening their skills. I do believe that those new to scripting and those who just completely lack scripting skills could benefit from a free scripting section. Just a thought.

And what is the use of this statement? I not seeing any use of that. The most threads are requests or help threads.

A possible solution is a scripting help section. I like to help and have no problem with that, but all these help and requests threads in the scripting section annoy me a lot. If I want to look up a script, I must scroll through a ton of useless threads.

The only problem I have with this idea is that scripting beginners feel the right, which they not have, to request scripts and then they get angry if noone helps them. We all have jobs, study, or have own projects. So we help in our free time for no reason. Most of the time we not even got a "thanks". That is ok. I know how hard it is to learn coding, that´s the reason why I help.
Also we could not buy a script and use it how we want, because all scripts are for a specific purpose(wider or smaller). Maybe I want a small change, then I must code.

ok, what I really want to say:
- I am pro a scripting help section, but against a request board
- There should be rules like how I post buyed scripts, or what I should do before posting, or post error codes. Of course both sides should be included when we do this.

We do, the free models and media section, media covers scripts as well.

The problem is as has been seen in the past on the FPSC forum, it's all well and good asking for help, but when people are constantly asking for people to write scripts for them with no obvious signs that they've at least tried themselves, or no sign that they are willing to help others it kind of gets frustrating, what's worse are those that ask for something without even having a basic look on the forums to see if there's already something out there. It kind of insulting to the hard work that others have done. And then there's posts asking over and over again for different scripts, mostly the most simple of scripts that are either default scripts or scripts that are so simple that someone could do with 5 minutes reading guides, without even showing that they tired and failed. I've even seen in the past scripts that are very similar to scripts posted for free/as a request show up in the store a few days after they've been posted, whether it's coincidence or not I don't know, but it seems a little suspicious.

That's why people get frustrated with requests, and that's probably why most of the forums have a no request rule.

I'm definitely not putting anyone down and I fully acknowledge that there are those like yourselves that have no problem helping others.

exactly what I said in my post. It makes me feel like I'm mooching when I seriously cannot get my head around scripting. I and many others who can't script have great ideas and just can't express them. I personally feel like I'm taking advantage of scripters because I do recognize it as a completely different and important skillset. I just thought it would actually help to have two scripting sections the way having two modeling and media sections did. I see scripting as something that should be paid for just like any other form of media.The statement wasn't meant to be offensive, just acknowledged as something that might deter others who just cannot script for asking for help.

The scripting section itself gives a lot of help and users are creating free scripts constantly ...
You only have to look at Smallg's thread https://forum.game-guru.com/thread/207801 to see how much help
and scripting he does for free ... He has written scripts for users who have simply asked .... " Is this script possible " the next thing smallg has written them one ... And its not just smallg who does this





Good examples of why there is no official request board ....
If you really really need help with a Game Stopper script then maybe Cake, Chocolate and goodies may work over PM

i think it sounds like a good idea but would likely leave the "non-request" section pretty empty as, as already was pointed out, most new requests are made without a simple search already anyway so why would they bother checking a whole different sub-thread?
i will add that even if you can't (or even don't have time) to script then simply showing you are working on something and that's why you need the script adds a lot to someone's willingness to help. (a link to a WIP would do)
i know team requests are not allowed but simply stating why you need a script for your particular project should be fine imo.
it's not essential of course, i personally try to help as much as i can but as corno said, there is only so much time in the day so sometimes some requests get unanswered and i would definitely prioritise those with more effort over a random "help please" (as long as i have time and the ability to answer of course)
so long as you're polite and give a good indication of what you want (you wouldn't simply say "i need a character" in the model section, the same applies for scripting) then i see no reason why requests can't be posted (and there are already plenty anyway), don't worry

I think the problem is if people just start demanding free scripts. I'm not a scripter but i think a lot of stuff depends on how you ask. If you're nice, tried yourself + actually appreciate that someone made an effort to help you for free, you can get a long way

Hate when you takes the time you don't have to write code/help someone, and he does not takes the time to back to the thread, just to say whether the suggested recipe works or does not, meanly because this may help others, with the same problem like you.

3com

Modelers got all the time in the world so a request board for models is necessary, nay compulsory


Happens all the time, there is even a sticky thread for 'available artists for free work' which works about as well as it did on the old forums...maybe a free script board would work out fine so scripters can ignore it and concentrate on the few proper requests for help in the existing script help board. Or even better simply concentrate on this product chat board which is a catch all for everything, I don't even have to visit other boards since most feature and script requests get posted here

The Mods don't seem keen to tidy these boards up and keep users informed as to which board is for which 'request' so another wouldn't make any difference.

From the 'available artists' sticky
Although it is the free models and not 3rd party models board and it is GameGuru not FPSC...so it's confusing, the board is for Artists to post free media. It isn't a request board and if users want that then the sticky is where to look but it doesn't work since Artists themselves don't want to set themselves up to be swamped with requests via pm, requests for 'someone to do it for you' should be locked...right ? Heck!...I even get requests for 'how to do such and such in GameGuru' in my store messages, which I didn't notice
It's the very same reason free script requests are disallowed but for the same reasons as all boards around here it is ignored and users 'requests and announcements' are all over the place with no forum polis to be seen, much like the real polis.

That's cool. Once again I so completely appreciate you guys.

Sort of.. OffTopic..



I think this is, (the not searching..), because the search engine is bad.
It only looks at the titles, and you need to be very specific.. eg.. "Drivable Vehicles" will be found.. but "Vehicles Drivable" wont..

Look at the link in SmallG's Free Scripts.. 20th link (or so..) says: zombies that follow waypoints
But try searching for this specific text.. you won't find SmallG's Free Scripts..
Search engine won't look in the threads itself.
No one will find SmallG's thread this way.

So, it's very difficult to search for (ready made) scripts/solutions (or whatever).

This is my experience.. might be that i'm doing something wrong. If so, please enlighten me.

Simply using 'vehicles' would throw up all threads with it in the title.
There is a way to search thread content for keywords (which I forget offhand) but maybe if this were built right into the search on the forum it would help with searching for info in badly titled threads.

Using smallg's thread as an example isn't cutting it for me since he posts all scripts in the first post and it doesn't take much to scan through the list, since he decided not to swamp the board and keep it in one thread he is doing it right far as I am concerned. Badly titled threads have always been an issue and users and mods alike need to tidy up the boards or vital info gets swamped and lost among all the garbage. Particularly when it isn't even posted in the proper board.

I could probably count on one hand the threads that are actually related to 'Product chat' on this boards first page today, while actual info gets thrown down to the second. Product chat has become the 'high traffic' catch all where users think their requests will be noticed more readily.

This is what we need, like the builtin google search on the "old" fpsc forums.
And your right, i can search for vehicles too and find the same threads.
Just showing the search button isn't working as it should.



ok, bad example.. but then again.. his thread is the only one this way (and stickied for good reasons).
and i only used his thread to show the search engine isn't cutting it.
Nothing found on "zombies that follow waypoints", while his first post states the exact phrase im searching for.

Okay, as predominantly a scripter I'm going to add my thoughts here.

I rarely post free scripts. I have done in the past and I probably will again. I put up tutorials on my Youtube channel quite often however, which generally involve scripting. Even then, people are not that willing to pause the video and copy out the script themselves. I often get asked for the actual script to download. This to me means that the person requesting the script only wants to add it in GG, they do not want to understand it. That's fair enough, apart from the fact that you NEED to understand scripting to make a game. At least to some degree.

If you make a game using other peoples scripts entirely, then is it really your game? Can you really feel proud of what you have made on the back of other peoples work? Media is not the same here. Yes, media makes a HUGE difference to a game, but most people expect to pay for it. Most free media is something artists feel not good enough to sell, or at least not to the standards they consider store material. It's rare to find free media that is top notch. There are exceptions of course, but in general no, it's stuff they think as WIP or practise, or old.

Scripting on the other hand is VITAL to a game. You can have all the media in the world, but with no scripting ability, it's not much use. Scripting is also way more specific to your game than media will ever be. I do my best when putting a script on the store to be general purpose for any game, but there is always something you may miss and there is always the chance that your script will conflict with another. Scripting needs a basic knowledge to be use-able. If you are clueless then you are going to be forever asking for help.

I have many ideas that I would like to implement. That's the easy part. It would make my GG experience way easier if I just asked for those ideas to be sorted by others. I never do this. I never ask for media either. I look on the store and buy it if I want it. Everyone starts with no idea how to code. If you want to make a game, it is just something you have to learn. To get to the point I am at, has taken many years of coding in different languages. I still consider myself average in this area, yet still manage to create scripts people want.

A requests board is just asking for people to take advantage. I've seen too many really, really bad GG game reviews on Jim Sterlings channel. They always look like people have grabbed some scripts, banged something together in no time and stuck the abortion on Steam. Help is one thing, but far too many just want it done for them and this is what we get. I recognise the devs of some of these games from the forums here (I won't mention any names). It has really opened my eyes to what some people are quite happy to do and has actually affected me even releasing some scripts at all, even on the store. It saddens me to see such awful releases giving GG a bad name. There's nothing wrong with buying a script to help you out, or even getting a free one. Having no idea how to tweak them though and you can get really bad games.

If I had access to this sort of thing back in the Speccy days I probably would be in the same boat as non-scripters now. I was FORCED to learn. That, or no game. Everyone can have ideas for a game. The ability to realise it is the difference. It takes time and effort. Programmers generally don't do media. Artists generally don't do code. Obviously there are exceptions, but there is a reason programmer art is a common term.

So, no. I don't agree at all with the reasoning behind this post. If you are unable to script, then you shouldn't be making games. You should join a team where your skills are useful. Yes, GG is supposedly an easy game creator, but I never thought that was a great idea in the first place to go that way. It encourages people who shouldn't even think about making games, to make a game. If you can model but can't code, you will find a coder willing to help you. They will probably be in the opposite boat.

All that said I'm happy to help people who want to learn. I find most request threads to be the exact opposite of that and have, over many years, got sick of it. Requests are not asking how do I do this? They are asking please do this for me. I can't subscribe to that. Scripting is a skill and shouldn't be expected for free, just because people are kind enough to release a few free models. Good stuff normally costs, as is the way of the world. Scripting doesn't come easy to me, it is hard work. Try to code it and post your code and I would be far more willing to help.

There is simply no excuse for saying coding is beyond you. If that is truly the case, see my team comment above. If you have skills in either modelling or music you will find one. If you went to see a doctor and he said I have no idea what I'm doing, but don't worry, I have Google! Would you be happy? You need some basic understanding at the very least. Richard Branson probably runs many businesses he has very little clue about in detail. He pays people to do for that sort of thing.

I'm guessing this will not be a popular comment, but I really feel strongly about having the skills to pay the bills, so to speak.

@ Disturbing 13. I would be glad to try to help you learn about basic scripting. I just don't want to write scripts for people who have no intention of learning and just want to get a game made. Especially if they have pretensions of releasing their game for actual money. I'm sure you could understand the basics with a bit of coaching. It's not as hard as it looks - basics I mean, complex stuff is very hard indeed, too hard for me, that's the entire reason I got GG, to avoid the mundane and hard stuff. I can only say try doing very simple things to start with. Even coding geniuses have to start somewhere and I am not one of them. Anything in life takes time for you to be good at it, unless you are lucky and talented. Me? I'm just focused and hard working. 30 years at the grindstone (on and off). If I were really talented, I'd be professional and a lot better off

Comment? LOL, You're giving Uman a run for the money when it comes to brevity! Anyway, I agree with your entire argument. You nailed every angle of it.

I agree almost totally with what DVAder said.

Which is why I never ask fro a full script, I always try myself first, then ask for help if I can't work it out for myself. I do buy scripts from the store, and I do use free scripts form the forum, however if you look at my scriptbank you will see multiple copies of each of these, each one adapted and changed to suit whatever project i'm working on, I never use a script out of the box, it's always changed in some way. I only use purchased/free scripts as a basis for the scripts I need.

The same with models, granted I do take advantage of free models, but I don't ask for them, but I generally start in the store (gotta support our fellow modellers ) and if I can't find it there I try to make it myself, only when I fail at that do I make any requests, so far I don't think I've requested anything except help since I first joined up here.

The only thing I ... not disagree .. maybe dispute? ... maybe that's too strong a word ... have a difference of opinion on? is what Dvader said about most free models being rejects, old, works in progress, not good enough for the store. There are many more models that are very worthy of store status on the forum here for free than there are low quality ones, personally I think a lot of the guys who give them for free actually give them because they want to give back tot he community, rather than thinking their work isn't good enough for the store.

My personal system is for every 10 or so items I create for the store, I offer a couple of free items on the forum. I do that because I want to do that, when I model I work with the goal to include free models because I want to give back to this great community, granted my work is mostly subpar, but that's not why I give models away free.

@DVader- I can see your point about a lot of what you said except this part-

I have to say yes. A team effort often shines much brighter than an individual handling every aspect of the creation. By the logic you've stated ,any game created in GG wouldn't be your own since you didn't code the engine. This would stand for the myriad of AAA titles created with Unreal or Havok or Unity. Wearing a lot of hats in game creation is great and commendable, but often some projects could be so much better if you have someone who is focused on that aspect of it helping out. How many really good indie games out there have only one person in the credits? I would gladly share credit with a team for a game rather than take sole credit just to say it's truly mine and have a lackluster project for it.
I also see media and scripting as just one of the many facets of game creation, all equally necessary whether you pay for the service or not, so I can't see why it's expected for people to pay for media but not scripting. If you can't model and what you need is available for purchase you would be foolish to not take advantage of that resource; the same goes for scripting. I can't script for the life of me and in my case it honestly has nothing to do with hard work. My brain is just not wired to understand its intricacies. I see scripting as a great talent. Anybody can learn the functions of a 3d modeling program, but if you don't have the talent your creations will not be as good as someone who deeply understands it. The same goes for scripting. I understand how it's used and how it brings our creations to life but I couldn't tell you one thing about double slash or double equal or even when to tab on what line or how one line effects the next or previous lines. Bottom line is I would rather share credit and say a game is 'ours' rather than have someone say it lacked in an area that I have no expertise in for the sake of calling it truly mine.

@ Anubis
Try:



hth

3com

@ Jerry Tremble. Yes, my post is a little epic. Not seen about here Uman for awhile now. Someone has to carry the torch

@ Belidos. I did say there were exceptions to my point about models. I stand by my point though, generally, it's down to the individual artists quality bar which decides whether they release on the store or for free. It doesn't mean they are rubbish, just not to the high standards some artists judge themselves by. I have some exceptional free media myself, so I know there is some great quality free stuff out there.

@ Disturbing 13. That was my point of being involved with a team. A group of people with different skill sets will normally always be able to make a more impressive game. The scripter for instance would understand scripting and therefore be able to craft things to suit the game being made far better than someone who doesn't. Having a good 3D artist for media would help in your games look and style, helping it avoid the mishmash you can get when adding media from several different artists. Same for music. Having a team of individuals who are good at all things will without doubt end up with a better finished product. In that case yes, you could be proud with the game you were involved with making

Game making is an art form and people who care about what they make, tend to make better games. The Steam releases I have seen, look like all they really care about, is making a quick buck. It doesn't help GG's rep at all to have virtually all games released torn apart by reviewers. Of course when I look at these games, I have an understanding of the work put in to get GG to so some the things done in them. I've seen games that look fairly impressive for GG panned that I thought, well for GG that's not that bad. Reviewers will never see that side of course, they see what else is available and compare with that in mind. We as users of GG will always judge them a tad more fairly.