Product Chat / Have your say on V1.007.

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Scene Commander
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Posted: 26th May 2014 11:00 Edited at: 26th May 2014 11:03
Hi all,



V1.007 is now out to all pledgers. You'll find the download link in your My Products.



Our focus for this build has mainly been AI, along with the addition of some new LUA commands to help you take your levels that step further.



Let us know what you think, and as always, if you do find bugs, please post them in the bugs forum.



Enjoy.



SC

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Duncan Peck
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Posted: 26th May 2014 11:32
Thanks very much for releasing it so early in the week! Put a smile on my face the moment I woke up and saw the email saying of its release. I played though the "two compounds mission" and I love the fact the AI is now more intelligent. I read through the list of improvements in v1.007 It looks like the team have been working hard on this. From playing it, it defiantly felt better. The AI characters actually seem to think!



Looking forward to completing a couple of competition levels now it's out



Thanks and keep up the good work!
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RustyNuts
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Posted: 26th May 2014 11:36
well I wasn't expecting that on a bank holiday Monday so thankyou very much.

All programmers are playwrights and all computers are lousy actors.
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SorrowCrown
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Posted: 26th May 2014 11:38 Edited at: 26th May 2014 12:06
Well... on lowest settings I am getting about 13 fps in two compunds level, so its unplayable. I have upgraded my graphics from gtx 650 2gb to r7 265x 2gb. I run Battlefield 4 now on ultra in multiplayer perfectly, but fpsc runs very bad.



Please....focus more on performance. There is no point of making something new if the performance is so bad. I can add X of entities and Ai in UDK for example and it runs perfectly smooth.
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CyberGamer
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Posted: 26th May 2014 11:49 Edited at: 26th May 2014 12:23
I ran v1.007, it uninstalled some 1.006 files and

continued to install 1.007 now there is no shortcut

icon on my desktop and there is no executable in

the FPSC Reloaded folder.

What did I do wrong?



Ok did a full uninstall (Uninstall.exe) re installed

now runs ok.

Amd Quad Core FX-4100 3.6MHz,GTX550Ti 1GB GDDR5,8GB DDR3

Windows 8.1 Pro

RustyNuts
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Posted: 26th May 2014 12:28
ok so this might seem trivial but it looks like the default 'lushy' grass has changed and now my competition level looks completely different.

All programmers are playwrights and all computers are lousy actors.
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smallg
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Posted: 26th May 2014 12:45
well have to say the test level (two compounds) is a HUGE improvement over the previous level... so nice - the AI is much better, the new effects on the screen add a lot of "flash" and it plays pretty nicely for a demo... good job!



will look into the LUA later as i'm now already late for work!

life's one big game

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wizard of id
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Posted: 26th May 2014 13:18 Edited at: 26th May 2014 13:59
1.007 has gone to hell , previously where I would get 44 FPS I get 12 now, with no AI still, Turning down all settings, gives me a measly 5 FPS more.



Terrain was altered looks worse now.The grass entity also looks worse,where you use to paint lots of grass there is barely any thing there.



Now I get Red screen of death where I didn't use, grass system still crashes test game.



All and all, my comp entry is completely ruined, it's unplayable runs out memory, simply useless, and I haven't even added AI.I barely used half of the allocated map area, didn't use nearly as much entities as I could.



OH the FOG is also wrong now, where it use allow you to see some of the back ground object, you can't barely see any thing like the sky.



I am not happy at all. AI improvements, more like, lets destroy the performance things we work on the last few months in little less than 4 weeks.



Visual difference between 1.006 and 1.007



meeeee
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Posted: 26th May 2014 14:12
WOW!! What a great beta release.Just tested a few of the new editions and they work really well.A.I are fun to hunt down now.Only problem I'm having is when I set the entity shader to medium it's the same as low.I'm using a low end pc and frame rates are fine until I put the entity shader to high,then they're halved.I'm currently making a dark lvl using the horror pack and using subtle light sources to highlight buildings,trees etc and it seems to really slow down performance.My graphics cards are a radeon hd 6470m and a hd 6480g (I did say low end...)but I don't think i'm in the minority.To fix this small problem would unleash reloaded to the masses of people who don't have (or can't afford)high end gaming rigs.Sounds like a rant but I still think this is the best $80 I've ever spent and the most fun I've had on my computer for a long time.And I thank you for that

tom
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Imchasinyou
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Posted: 26th May 2014 14:37 Edited at: 26th May 2014 14:44
My frames have dropped as well. Here is a screen shot. On my buildings, when I walk into them or at some areas around the houses, they disappear where as they didnt before. Any ideas on that?







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synchromesh
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Posted: 26th May 2014 14:47 Edited at: 26th May 2014 14:52
The good bits !!



Love the Tab feature for the models ...Although I thought it was going to be iffy it actually works great



At last I can drown.. Finally we can go underwater...Now we need a scuba mask to allow us to breath



The new F9 settings are so much better and the entity editor is working again....



The bad bits !!



Two compounds is quite slow although there is a lot going on...I need to play around to get the best out of that....Although Get to the river appears faster ?



All the veg and grasses have been changed so I can understand wizard of id being a bit annoyed after loading his map and all his time spent on it.



However...Starting a brand project now you can make it look awesome and no slowdown really noted from my fresh maps yet.



I cant seem to raise objects in the F9 Editor but the rest works ok



The barrels don't explode yet



The Chugshot isn't there yet



Its a big jump and im actually quite happy with all the new features.. Anyone buying this today and using it for the first time would be pretty impressed I think.
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almightyhood
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Posted: 26th May 2014 14:52 Edited at: 26th May 2014 14:53
to raise objects right click in editor then use pg up down and A and D to move them in a kinda 3d view makes it so much easier now



also you can pick up entities from off tables and inside buildings aswell

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MadLad Designs
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Posted: 26th May 2014 15:01 Edited at: 26th May 2014 15:04
1/. I've found that if i go underwater I can't resurface and I drown (The two-compounds level).



2/. The 'Dark' skybank (in my Horror game) suddenly look's very low quality and stretched (I have everything on Highest setting).







3/. The 'Door frame exterior' from the Horror pack were turned 90% in my horror level (easy just to reangle them though).

Check out the [FPSC Reloaded FAQ]!



Also check out my YouTube Gaming Channel: /user/MadLadDesigns
Grooovy!
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Posted: 26th May 2014 15:29
OK,



The thing I immediately noticed is that the terrain texture repitition factor has changed (or the re-sizing of the textures).

The texture repetition is now much more apparent of flatter surfaces, making the landscape look a little carpet-ish.



See pictures below:













Is there a setting to adjust this?

Brook's Law ..."adding manpower to a late software project makes it later"
wizard of id
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Posted: 26th May 2014 15:36
Quote: "All the veg and grasses have been changed so I can understand wizard of id being a bit annoyed after loading his map and all his time spent on it."
A bit, that is an understatement, removed every single tree, removed the grass completely, a measly 33 frames with 420k polygons rendered on screen at any given time.



So I spend 3 and half weeks working on a map with the average frame rate of no less than 30, reduced to a pile of useless junk, annoyed, banned words is more like it.



Proper outdoor scene have gone to hell sparsely populated outdoor level, will most likely still give you bad frame rates.



I am sorry they broke more than what they fixed, is completely unplayable, not good enough.
The Next
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Posted: 26th May 2014 15:45
Quote: "The Chugshot isn't there yet"




Coming to a store near you soon.



Quote: "All the veg and grasses have been changed so I can understand wizard of id being a bit annoyed after loading his map and all his time spent on it."




I am sure Lee can patch this when he is back from his bank holiday. I don't think a change like this was intentional none of the internal testers reported an issue.



Quote: "My frames have dropped as well."


This is the first version of the AI and as I understand it, it isn't fully optimised yet and is very CPU intensive. This will be worked on for sure, they are aware of the slow downs.



Anyone that is having issues with grass not looking the same ensure your sliders for veg height, width and quantity are the same as they were in V1.006, I think they may have changed by default.



Keep the feedback coming, TGC will be looking into this tomorrow it is a UK bank holiday today so the dev team aren't around.

Windows 7 Pro, Intel i7 3.8 GHz, 16GB DDR3, NVIDIA GTX 780 4GB Superclocked
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synchromesh
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Posted: 26th May 2014 16:02 Edited at: 26th May 2014 16:03
Quote: "The texture repetition is now much more apparent of flatter surfaces, making the landscape look a little carpet-ish."




Agreed but im guessing it will get sorted.. The hills now look much better and don't stretch so badly....Adding a paint to it as well makes some great effects



@The Next... Brill any idea when
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Scene Commander
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Posted: 26th May 2014 16:07
Hi All,



AI is a little intensive at the moment, but don't worry, multicore support is scheduled, so performance will leap up.



@Imchasinyou



We are aware of some clipping issues with custom media, we are investigating that and should have a fix for V1008.



The screenshots you provided to demonstrate performance loss aren't the same, so don't show as a comparision. You would need to post a shot from V1006 and one from V1007 of exactly the same view, using the same settings for us to see.



@WOI



I'm sorry you're having issues, could you also please post shots from V1006 and V1007, showing the performance drop, also ensuring that the settings are identical.



Many thanks,



SC

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Posted: 26th May 2014 16:09
Quote: "Agreed but im guessing it will get sorted.. The hills now look much better and don't stretch so badly"




Yes... just noticed that!

I'm guessing this is a trade-off between "stretchy" hills and "carpety" flats



It shows up most in the new desert terrain packs, tgc desert terrain 3 being the most obvious.



I'm sure this'll get fixed up. Meanwhile, with a little creative spray-painting, we can continue!

Brook's Law ..."adding manpower to a late software project makes it later"
Imchasinyou
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Posted: 26th May 2014 16:29
Quote: "@Imchasinyou



[quote=]We are aware of some clipping issues with custom media, we are investigating that and should have a fix for V1008.



The screenshots you provided to demonstrate performance loss aren't the same, so don't show as a comparision. You would need to post a shot from V1006 and one from V1007 of exactly the same view, using the same settings for us to see."




Of course they are different, part of the installation process means I must remove 1.006. Thus, Its not possible to get a screen shot of that. Im not going to spend the time to delete 1.007 to reinstall 1.006. Had I known ahead of time about clipping issues and what not, Id gladly gotten a screen shot before installing 1.007.



Ill have to wait for the next version. How about a hot fix right quick to fix it? Id gladly reinstall 1.007 for a fix rather than wait a month or more for the next release.



Not trying to sound crass here but honestly, had I known ahead of time, I would have expected it and KNOWN that TGC was aware of it instead of finding it myself.



"We are aware of some clipping issues with custom media, we are investigating that and should have a fix for V1008."

Sorry, i didnt see that mentioned in the release notes. Ill go read it again.

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Scene Commander
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Posted: 26th May 2014 16:36 Edited at: 26th May 2014 16:43
Quote: "Of course they are different, part of the installation process means I must remove 1.006. Thus, Its not possible to get a screen shot of that. Im not going to spend the time to delete 1.007 to reinstall 1.006. "




Then I'm afraid we can't see any performance issues you are having, making it difficult to fix.



Quote: "Not trying to sound crass here but honestly, had I known ahead of time, I would have expected it and KNOWN that TGC was aware of it instead of finding it myself."




As you know, this is a BETA product, you will find bugs and issues, that is the nature of the beast. If you feel strongly that Reloaded isn't delivering for you, as Lee has stated in the past, there are other engines on the market you can try. You can always return to Reloaded when it is out of Beta, as a pledger you will always receive free updates as well as the finished product on completion.



SC

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wizard of id
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Posted: 26th May 2014 16:39
Quote: "@WOI



I'm sorry you're having issues, could you also please post shots from V1006 and V1007, showing the performance drop, also ensuring that the settings are identical.



Many thanks,



SC

"




Settings are the same however, did find a bug, related to the massive frame rate drop noticed it by accident actually was playing around in test mode when I pressed F9, after trying to tweak the grass a bit, pressed F9 again, and what do you know my frame rate shot up to what it formally was mid 30's high 40's.



So there is a bug, some where, you frame rate doesn't just drop like that, for no reason, AI isn't simply enough to cause such a massive drop, Lee broke some thing.



I was worried there for a minute.



However the grass problem is related to lee editing the I spray mode which spots things overlapping, which is fine for entity placement, however this presents a problem for the vegmask, grass isn't as thick as it use too be.



I am just happy that I can still work on my level, regardless, simply means pressing F9 to get it going again.Just have to test the build if the same thing works there as well



SHJOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !!!!!!!!!!!!! I was mad there for a minute
Scene Commander
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Posted: 26th May 2014 16:42
@WOI.



Phew.. That sounds like you've found the cause. I'll be compiling a list of issues for the development team this week, so you can rest assured that one will be on it.



SC

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wizard of id
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Posted: 26th May 2014 16:47 Edited at: 26th May 2014 16:58
Good news is that F9 trick works in the saved.exe as well, so that is a relieve as well, this also means we probably get another release before the comp ends, I hope, otherwise, we should just make use of F9 in the interim.



The only thing I still need to confirm, with the F9 trick is how it will effect the AI runtime, if it stops it completely when you return from editing, or will the AI just carry on. ?



*Edit

Nope, prefect work around for the frame rate problem F9 freezes AI, exiting F9 unfreezes them and they just go about there business of killing you, or running like a headless chicken into entities and up vertical cliffs :p
Alien Menace
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Posted: 26th May 2014 18:07
The performance is pretty abysmal. I have an i7 2600k and two GTX460 video cards SLI in my system. I never have performance issues at HD with any game I have played. Fraps reportst that the test compound level only runs at 22-30 fps with an average I would say being around 22-24. Not good. Should be at least 3 or 4 times that on my system for that level of complexity. Nice effort but definitely not ready for prime time

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Steohl72
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Posted: 26th May 2014 18:15
EPIC FAIL!



So you add some water physics, you drown when going into deep water. BUT you forgott to add the ability to swim!?

Disaster.
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Scene Commander
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Posted: 26th May 2014 18:21
Swimming hasn't been added yet. We've stated several times that we consider water to be an update in it's own right. So, not a fail, but an incomplete feature .



SC

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Dralel
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Posted: 26th May 2014 18:31
Can we have the ability to change the default model floating hands? I know this isn't a priority but I would at least like a confirmation that we can, in the future, change this.

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World Class Multimedia
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Posted: 26th May 2014 19:10 Edited at: 26th May 2014 19:20
My level, which worked perfectly in 1.006 now will not run in 1.007. Tons of work now down the tubes.



I will see if I can make it run, but I just don't want to erase all entities and start over - again!



Please fix this.



I am getting a Windows 8 error - "FPSCR Map Editor has stopped working", then it crashes and reloads the map in the editor.



As i'm sure you understand, holding a contest and then changing the engine so drastically that it now does not work with the previous version makes for a useless and completely frustrating competition. It's not fair to have to start over multiple times due to so many bugs and problems. I understand it's a beta, but perhaps a competition is not such a good idea when you are going to knowingly change things. It is honestly beating me up to a point where I do not really care any more about creating an entry. I have other things I have to do for clients and this is really time consuming, frustrating and pointless.



HELP!



Mike

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Titantropo
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Posted: 26th May 2014 20:06
First the ennemies were too dumb. Now they are too smart. If one finds me, the others come running to shoot me. The problem is that they are pretty far away...

Here, there and everywhere.
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RazorNet7
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Posted: 26th May 2014 20:10
1.07 skyboxes are down....terrain is worse...frame rates down

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smallg
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Posted: 26th May 2014 20:25
strangely i have fine FPS on two compounds... much better compared to what it used to be when AI was involved (5 AI was enough to make me crawl... now it's a solid 40+)



Thank you for the instant script re-loading!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

soooooooooo much nicer now we don't have to close reloaded to adjust the scripts!!

life's one big game

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SpaceWurm
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Posted: 26th May 2014 20:52
Haha! Had quite a blast taking on the enemies. Really loving the AI now! Nice work guys. Framerate is between 30-60 FPS. Now I shall throw my money at TGC to upgrade to Gold Pledge.



Landman

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wizard of id
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Posted: 26th May 2014 21:12
sky boxes are def worse, terrain isn't too bad, however the seamless tiling is pretty bad.



Fog is very bad.Hides skybox completely instead of having height limit.



Auto entity height adjustment results in horrible jerking when trying to place



Grass not overlapping, too patchy, irrespective of veg mask intensity



Making a large island and removing the land completely round it right to the edge results in a red screen of death



Static screen bug is still there.



Editing terrain will still result in the grass crash error.



Frame rate Bug on detailed maps, pressing F9 twice, normal frame rate resume, Is stuck on 13 to 16 frame otherwise.



Player can get stuck in the terrain more easily



Doing a fair amount of entity editing, will result in a black screen crash on a detailed map.



Entity editing mode still causes performance issues



With fog enabled from a high enough area, land is visible underwater, reflection in only seen right next to land further away, no reflection and land is visible



If there is a sloped terrain with a wall sunk into the ground AI collision doesn't work correctly, AI gets stuck in wall.



AI still dumb will try to run up slopes instead of retreating on flat ground.



Some tree shadows still not displaying correctly.



Visually this beta is the worst so far regardless of AI, rather sad. Was looking forward to it
Pirate Myke
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Posted: 26th May 2014 21:51
@WOI:



Not seeing the fog hiding the skybox at different levels on My machine. (middle of Vid sequence) Just the water is non being clipped in the fog plain.





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DolphinLover30
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Posted: 26th May 2014 22:09
Still crying here because I can not run it worth testing on my current computer, Acer aspire one 722 Netbook ... graphics are fine it can handle it easy but my processor is basically a p4 on steroids being only a 1.3 dual core so not even worthy to call dual core. Soon though, soon the new box will reside in front of me muahahahahahahahahahaha

This town is infested with killer cockroaches .. repeat .. killer cockroaches !!
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Posted: 26th May 2014 22:41
so you consider this to be correct, cloudy sky box used fog is far away enough, can see the land under water, can't see the sky box at all, where previously you could use fog quite close and still make out the sky box now you can't see any thing.







Even worse the fog seems to be applied circular to the sky box.Only the middle of the sky box is visible , so if you were to use , the golden skybox the middle will be redish the rest will be the colour of the fog.
TattieBoJangle
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Posted: 26th May 2014 22:53
Fog works ok for me









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Slaur3n
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Posted: 26th May 2014 22:58
the fog is exactly how i wanted it to be awesome!
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Posted: 26th May 2014 23:00 Edited at: 27th May 2014 00:00
Not that I had that kind of view. But this is not better from the angle as you point out.



From the angle I had from my POV in the video, the water was the only bad part even again the skybox from a distance.



The sky box being seen, seems to be at a ratio to the perceived skybox height and the slider setting of the far and near fog. As I went thru them, And looking straight up (I forgot to mention this in my video) I was able to see the fog level height drop, but had not considered a higher mountain view than I got in the last few slide of the video. Guess they will be sorting this out later.



Here is another video of different heights and distances.





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World Class Multimedia
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Posted: 26th May 2014 23:01
Magically, my level started working. Not sure what I did to make it work.



One entity was missing and turned out I needed to re-download all store purchases and entities that came with the gold pledger.



Hmmm. Interesting, but at least I do not need to start completely over!



Mike

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wizard of id
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Posted: 26th May 2014 23:02
To get the fog right for my level requires it at nearest 2 and distance at 10.Any thing more than that AI and too much of the level can be seen ahead.



On land the fog is good over water it is bad.
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Posted: 26th May 2014 23:09
Quote: "First the ennemies were too dumb. Now they are too smart. If one finds me, the others come running to shoot me. The problem is that they are pretty far away..."




LOL .. ye I noticed they tend to bring their mates.... Lee has created Masons....They have the secret hand signals
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synchromesh
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Posted: 26th May 2014 23:16 Edited at: 26th May 2014 23:24
Graphically I noticed the colours are not so vibrant...the green is duller and it looks all toned down slightly..



The Tab function on the models is still blowing me away though... I thought Lee was nuts when he mentioned chopping the roofs off....But hell it works so well

Also V1007 is 40meg smaller ?
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wizard of id
3D Media Maker
18
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Joined: 16th Jan 2006
Playing: CSGO
Posted: 26th May 2014 23:32 Edited at: 26th May 2014 23:34
Added some AI, works pretty well except for the magically vanishing AI.



AI def doesn't work well in enclosed spaces with walls, had 10 AI in the first 1km of the level has about 10km total and frame rate dropped to 14, so 1 AI per KM it seems to be the limit with loads of AI health..sigh lol
Jackal
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Joined: 2nd Dec 2009
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Posted: 26th May 2014 23:44
The good:

AI way better.

Love the drown feature.

Frames are a little better.

Terrain textures look better, at least when set to high. Dont care to much for terrain on highest.

Editor is looking nice.

New fog is great. Its way better then the old fog.




The Bad:

Terrain looks tiled.

Normal Maps dont show up very well on objects.




Keep up the good work

"Vae Victis" P.S I am a GOLD Backer of this project. I'm just to lazy to email for my badge. If your reading this, then your probably thinking that I could of sent that email instead of typing this. Well, you wouldn't be wrong! Now that you have read all of this....Back This Project. Thank You And Have A Good Day or Morning or maybe evening....
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Steohl72
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Joined: 1st Sep 2013
Location: Sweden
Posted: 27th May 2014 00:02 Edited at: 27th May 2014 00:04
Quote: "Swimming hasn't been added yet. We've stated several times that we consider water to be an update in it's own right. So, not a fail, but an incomplete feature .



SC"




Would it not had been better to leave it alone then, until it's finished?

It was better as it was before, now you can't make it over water any more. That's quite bad.
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synchromesh
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Posted: 27th May 2014 00:11
Quote: "now you can't make it over water any more. That's quite bad. "




Its not that bad

You cant walk on water in real life...you really would normally go around...They just have not added the swimming function yet... Its a bit more real now I reckon ..
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danjo
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Joined: 29th Dec 2005
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Posted: 27th May 2014 01:28
those trying to make a game and then complaining things changed should REMEMBER IT IS STILL BETA !
RazorNet7
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Joined: 14th Mar 2014
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Posted: 27th May 2014 01:49
By turning up the Fog Distance fixed all of my skybox problems.. Wow/..People with this problem might find they bumped those down for some reason…

R7

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