Product Chat / Third person perspective

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tommy8
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Posted: 27th Apr 2014 06:04 Edited at: 27th Apr 2014 06:05
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I just found this video, which looks awesome. Is it still going ahead or not?



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Slaur3n
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Posted: 27th Apr 2014 14:09
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in a couple of years maybe
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Scene Commander
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Posted: 27th Apr 2014 18:31
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3rd person is planned, but we are focusing on a 1st person engine at the moment. Small steps .

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Uman
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Posted: 27th Apr 2014 19:39
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I had never seen that video before relating specifically to Reloaded.



Big plus for an engine that one.



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Super Clark
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Posted: 27th Apr 2014 19:55 Edited at: 27th Apr 2014 19:56
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This is very cool and would be a great asset to the Reloaded going forward.



Variety is the spice of life:

(Special time needs to be put to making this possible in the Reloaded Engine)



Sooner than Later ... Not years down the line, as this will bring more

Sponsorship for Reloaded. And make the dream of a multi adaptable game

creating engine that much more of 'got to have that' than 'you can only do'



Just my 2p worth.
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tommy8
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Posted: 27th Apr 2014 20:38
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this is one of those 'would rather see it sooner than later' things.



3rd person is a big component of my game designs.
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rolfy
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Posted: 27th Apr 2014 21:47 Edited at: 27th Apr 2014 21:50
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All those animations and a lot more are actually in the model file, many haven't even been touched upon yet. I know your thinking of this for third person but for npc's at least you will be able to use them when the proper Lua scripting commands are put in.



The word is that they are starting to look at using many of these animations right now as they start work on AI
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Teabone
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Posted: 27th Apr 2014 21:50 Edited at: 27th Apr 2014 21:53
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All possible with the future of LUA.



I remember playing around with the 3rd person scripts in FPSC Classic. Can't recall who developed those but was pretty neat.



Expect to see this around the same time as vehicles I'd say. Since they would be scripted in a similar fashion. Pretty much just controlling an entity and positioning the camera differently.

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rolfy
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Posted: 27th Apr 2014 21:56 Edited at: 27th Apr 2014 22:13
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The best work done on third person was abandoned, which was by Aegul,a major disappointment to me. He only released a time limited mod for it and never showed again



I only got one one level out of it before he disappeared.







Quote: "Expect to see this around the same time as vehicles I'd say. Since they would be scripted in a similar fashion. Pretty much just controlling an entity and positioning the camera differently."
Maybe a little more than that, camera clipping through walls and so forth, did use some of those scripts but nothing really did it all properly, kudo's to those that tried though.
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pianodavy
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Posted: 27th Apr 2014 22:02
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Just for the record - that video was posted on YouTube November 6, 2012 - a year and a half ago. Third person is not really a feature that will give this software an upper hand in the game making market - but it is probably essential enough for many users to consider it a worthwhile tool. I can only employ FPSCR for segments of projects which, unfortunately, lack significant impact - and simply because the features are, so far, amounting to little more than eye-candy at the moment - and not really very tempting eye-candy at that. Don't get me wrong - I'm not complaining - I have great faith in the development of this software and where it will eventually arrive. That being said, my but-and-however remains in this simple hope - that some day many of artists who support TheGameCreators's products will be able to accredit their software designers with supplying the tools needed to achieve the superb products their audience demands. Of course, third person capability is only one of several features needed - but if the users of FPSCR don't express their needs - which are often actually requirements for justifying the use of this product in their work - then the software developers won't perceive the necessities of meeting their customers needs. And I guess that is the key to it all, right? I mean, recognizing that buying this software is indicative of the fact that we are all customers with exacting needs, right? Ha! 'Nuff said!

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tommy8
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Posted: 27th Apr 2014 22:54
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I am wondering (and hoping) that this sort of precedence will open the door for even more genre possibilities with FPSCR.



For example squad based shooters, or even RTS.
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Uman
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Posted: 30th Apr 2014 23:57
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Yes as said, though Third Person as far as I am aware to date was and is not on the cards in any list of priority it is one of those pre-requisites and important features that Reloaded could benefit immensely from and attract a much wider supporter and user base by a large order of magnitude.



It is perhaps the single feature which could bring in by far, more supporters than any other.



The only other that could compete with that I would think would be more platform support and that is likely to be further away if it was to be of any real strength in its quality. That's a much harder nut to crack I would think and do it well and right and asking for a great deal from Reloaded and TGC.



I would prefer Third Person to any consideration of adding another platform as to me its a question of priority and Third Person wins hands down. Why - well because its a great much welcome and needed feature without going off on a new platform tangent which does not add any actual feature to the game makers toolset.



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Dralel
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Posted: 29th May 2014 05:17
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Bumping this as I would love to see third person or at least full body awareness, whichever is easier to program first. Would be a dream.

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DVader
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Posted: 29th May 2014 23:58
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I think it has been eluded to that TGC want to add this feature at some point. Once things more important are in place I'm sure they will add in this ability. Or of course they will make it possible via scripting. It may even be possible now, at least in a limited way, given I haven't touched much on the new commands I couldn't say. Probably not, but it seems as if the ability to move the player has been added as I asked looking at the scripts section. All that is needed is the ability to move, and shoot,and animate a character etc with the ability to control the camera ourselves. Still, as I do not know how it has been coded that may be a major change in the base code. Still in the main it should be fairly simple, especially if they have the anims already made and ready. Still, not a huge priority as yet. Until there are way more characters available for Reloaded we are all stuck with 2 soldiers who look fairly similar. My biggest gripe with reloaded so far is the lack of decent characters. The zombie pack will help, but considering all the characters out the old packs we can't use now it's not exactly gonna be a huge increase. I imagine many people find the thought of modeling and animating characters fairly daunting and probably beyond their skill set! Not too mention time consuming.

Not that I want to change the threads subject, just highlighting the lack of characters we could use for this feature as most peoples circumstance will be.



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Dralel
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Posted: 30th May 2014 00:05 Edited at: 30th May 2014 00:51
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There is definetly a lack of characters, which is why I voted for a character creator quite high on the vote list. And yeah I think you may be right in that it may be technically possible to create it now, we'd just need the characters and animations mainly. There are FPSCR compatible LUA commands that can move the player via key commands as well, the problem might be is getting the camera correct, especially with syncing them to the animations.



Having said that, wouldn't it be easier to include full body awareness? You'd need the character(s) and animations but you don't have to put as much effort into it than making an entire new view, right?

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rolfy
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Posted: 30th May 2014 02:08 Edited at: 30th May 2014 02:09
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It's all down to scripting, there are a whole bunch of characters which will work just fine once somebody with the scripting skills comes along and either writes all new or finds a way to convert from fpi. It doesn't require anything additional to make a character work in Reloaded from the modelers end.



Of course if your happy to have the engine running it all and using the animations from the Reloaded stock characters then that's all fine, but not going to help with flying,quadrapeds or anything much else rather than running around with a gun which wont suit many zombies either, all the same they must be doing a different animation set for the zombie pack and you could probably rig your own to those and again live at the mercy of the AI system.



Basically if you can move the entity in any direction and speed and call the correct anims to play then you have a fully working animation system for characters and that's all in there with new beta



As for third person it takes a lot more than simply tagging a camera onto a character, you will have to solve clipping through walls and all that happy stuff that goes along with it, many have made decent efforts but no one ever fully solved it all in Classic.

A funny thing happened on the way to the forum...
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Dralel
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Posted: 30th May 2014 18:33
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What about using the animations that are in those sets of videos?

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LeeBamber
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Posted: 3rd Jun 2014 23:49
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Third Person is more than just character animation and movement, but I won't bore you with the details We're going to get FPS 'First Person Shooter' part done first, and then we can look at other perspectives of game-play and third is high up there.

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tomjscott
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Posted: 4th Aug 2014 20:58
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I'm making a push to get some new commands in scripting that would allow me to build a 3rd person controller right now. The only issue that would remain would be camera collisions with static entities, which would take a bit more on Lee's part to give us. I think there are ways it can be worked around, but that'll be something I'll need to deal with once/if I get the commands in-hand. As a bonus, the added commands also allow for a variety of other possibilities not related to 3rd person at all such as teleportation, aligning custom characters and entities to the terrain, and more.

I'm awaiting Lee's feedback on my idea. If he goes ahead with it then I'll be working on a prototype. That being said, I am going to need some custom characters to really test this with. Stock characters just aren't going to make the grade because they'll lack all the requisite animations you typically need for 3rd person such as climbing, jumping (do reloaded characters jump?), pushing, pulling, etc. So, if this ends up happening, are there any talented character animators out there willing to help with a prototype?

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Posted: 4th Aug 2014 21:17
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Custom characters we have getting them to work with reloaded we cant like for example i have a load of custom characters all come with a list of animations and the ranges for example.



Are we not stuck to reloaded animations ? or do you have a custom LUA & FX to control the animations.





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Posted: 4th Aug 2014 21:19
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No, you can use any animations you want. Animations would be controlled through Lua scripting. If you have custom characters right now, I can help you get them animating in reloaded. That's how I took old classic characters and got them working in Rescue the Princess. The fpe file just needs to specify the animation frames.

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Posted: 5th Aug 2014 14:20
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I think a major thing is third person camera control. Automatic zoom in to avoid the cameraview to be obstructed by e.g. a wall or object, turning the character semi transparent in zoomed in mode.

I think there are major titles which have camera issues in third person camera mode.
I believe fixed camera is easier in most cases but also unflexible and maybe hard to navigate by (judging by some adventure titles featuring such techniques) - and of course aiming.

Related to Third person I've got a quick question: I do not know if there are functions for mirroring (a quick google search does not result in direct DX9 functions for this) - is this planned to work (should be a bit similar to Water Reflection effects).

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LeeBamber
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Posted: 7th Aug 2014 20:48
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Adding a reflective surface is an exercise in 3D torture from a programming point of view, largely to the performance cost it incurs. Reloaded currently uses the technique to have reflective water, but there has been no large community gravitas to ask for real reflective surfaces like mirrors in the game.

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