Hi all,
I've leveraged last week sales to purchase GG Classic (and appgame kit Stdio) . GG Installation went okay but the app is very unstable for me. I did check my drivers and PC, but even this not solved my issues. My Win PC is not top by run fine some other games ( the Circle, Fornite ) for hours with avp FPS 50/60 : Win10/16g/FX8/HD7850 . GG Demo maps on test run smoothly with the same average FPS, however they quickly crash . I've been looking the forums ans saw some similar issues but was unable to find the workaround to fix those . .. Any help is welcome and will be more than appreciated.

In short
- Character editor : trying to load a photo craches the editor ( it reboot staying he has an unexpected issue)
- sometimes i have a Green screen , and all the system is "lost in the deep space", i have to reboot the PC
- Loading maps and plying around , the system even freeze ( I have to kill It ) or editor reboot
- Please do note I'm running DX12 ( as win10) , it should not be an issue al all old games work fine


What I've done so far
- Update GPU driver and check windows install ( it is ok )
- Checked app with Steam ( I'm new to it) : 13 file where replaced , since then it is even worse :-( ( it crashes faster )
- I searched for a log or to set a debug verbose mode on a .ini file but did not find such param.

I found a message in windows ( In French but easy to understand ) . However this can be the consequence not the cause of the issue, i've not been able to found a debug log in Gameguru and/or a param on commandline to enter a debug/verbose mode

Should you have an idea !!!
Thanks in advance

"Nom de l’application défaillante Guru-MapEditor.exe, version : 1.0.0.0, horodatage : 0x5f3e6db0
Nom du module défaillant : ntdll.dll, version : 10.0.18362.815, horodatage : 0x2995af02
Code d’exception : 0xc0000374
Décalage d’erreur : 0x000dfa1d
ID du processus défaillant : 0x2444
Heure de début de l’application défaillante : 0x01d6cb24d8e09be8
Chemin d’accès de l’application défaillante : D:\Jeux\steam\steamapps\common\Game Guru\Guru-MapEditor.exe
Chemin d’accès du module défaillant: C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM32\ntdll.dll
ID de rapport : 773d4b73-378d-4fc7-a8be-e2015deddf01
Nom complet du package défaillant :
ID de l’application relative au package défaillant : "

I'm not sure what the problem could be for you. But I just wanted to address your line about Direct X 12:

What a lot of people don't realise, and a mistake people make is that just because you have Windows 10 and DirectX 12 is default installed, doesn't mean your system is actually using DirectX 12, and doesn't mean it is compatible with all previous version of DirectX.

DirectX is a driver, it can be installed but not be used due to hardware, if for example your graphics card is not a DirectX 12 compatible it won't use DirectX 12 no matter how many times you install it. It will default to a basic version of the DirectX the card can handle, which leads to the second point, while DirectX 12 has some basic backwards compatability with DirectX 11, it's not true DirectX 11, there are still some dependencies missing in some cases, so just having dx12 installed doesn't mean you can fully run everything dx11.

No Directx is an API, not a driver basically the middleware between, software and GPU driver. It will use DX12 regardless of whether the card supports it or not it would actually depend on the software and hardware whether or not the actual libraries in the API is used based on hardware support. So it doesn't mean if you installed the latest libraries and don't have the supported hardware it won't work as the API does have legacy support so it really doesn't matter.

Hiall

Thanks for your help, you are both right (Direct X is an API and its call functions are/arent interpreted by the hardware) but they should be backward compatible. My card indeed is a DX11 compatible one, but it works fine with recent dx12 games with no issues.

* My intention talking about DX12 was because I saw a thread talking about it : in short, we can have DX11 installed alongside DX 12 ( it is possible IMO) but then force GG to use DX11 (Line command param , ini file ?) .. I never saw the answer. If someone did this, I will appreciate his help.
* Regarding the "green screen of death" I saw other post on this , but as well no answer : happy if someone has a debug mode somewhere , should be easier to diagnose with proper trace as error it Reproductible and Repeatable ( i.e it will always crash doing the same set of actions) . Should I need to change/update something in my config I will do and will post back my findings
* Also, I saw some advice on un-installing Steams and GG game : I'm new on Steams (Well i think I used it some 15/20 years go for installing CS and Half.life to my kids) . Is this something safe (Should I be able to reinstall GG after this ? ) . what is method you are proposing , in a thread a user told uninstall was not perfect and he always had to use external software.

Sorry for my many questions as I'm just staring with GG ? I hope to soon learn and be able to offer more help and feedback.

Regards

Raf

Ps : edit for some rephrasing/typos

Sorry you're right it's an API, I used the wrong terminology, what I meant is that even with dx12 installed dx11 stuff doesn't always work, sometimes you have to install dx11 files to supplement it.

Still no, if you were to download the DX installer from the Microsoft website it will still install legacy libraries like DX 9, 10 ect ect.It doesn't just install dx12.Even dependency libraries that come with games update in a similar way, it is rare for these libraries to only install the dx dependencies needed.

These libraries may on occasion go corrupt or library files go MIA and sometimes there may be a library conflict, it is generally rare but does happen, sudden power failure, incorrect installation, or failed update ect.

Thanks,
Do you know any way to set a debug/trace mode ? either command line or .ini file? to ease the diagnose ? I saw other people reporting also crashes or green screens of death. Some are recommending to reinstall Steam, is this fine ( I 'm new to it and want to ensure i will be able to reinstall GG after this, i guess yes but worth to check. Any tips and trick is welcome .
btw, I was able to do a standalone game and this one is working fine , hence why I'm focussing on the Editor.
Rgds
Raf

To your actual problem, I have had similar issues with my AMD GPU, would work fine with other games, some times they would crash for no reason, especially counterstrike global offensive.

Gameguru might work fine for the entire day and the next day it would conk out for no reason.I discovered it was related to the AMD driver being buggy.So you might need to test out a few older GPU drivers and find the most stable.I also found that fan controller on AMD gpu's can be slow to react to increase in temps , which also crashes the AMD driver often.So generally have the fan speed set to max speed when using gameguru as it generally uses all of the gpu processing resources and especially true for weaker and older GPUs. Definitely monitor your GPU temps as that is a common culprit as well for crashes.


Since manual control of the GPU fans and finding a stable driver, I don't get any crashes.

Thanks , that a good trail
I installed the latest just to make sure I was up to date but it seems it might not be a good idea..
Can you tell me please which driver version you are running ? I will try this as my baseline
Cheers
Raf

No idea.But note you have a much older gpu so the same driver won't be much help.Your card is about 8 years old more or less so you would likely need to go back quite a bit to find a stable one that plays well with gameguru.

My experience is the exact opposite, had 3 problem free years with my old PC with AMD GPU and drivers, my new machine with NVidia GPU and drivers a has been a pita.

Hi Wizard,
Your previous comment helped me , I had a glance to the new Driver Panel control, and it had the GPU fan control set to 30%. I set this to automatic and so far no crash after 2 hours on it. Temp reached 46° playing around on Editor/standalone map all setting to max/ 64FPS avg as per Steam (temp is 25 on Idle) . Yes indeed card is a "bit" old since part of an old dusty AM3 PC i'm resurrecting
However happy to see how it performs, old techno (135w) but still running ( OC version 2GB/DDR5) , i will see if I find one more modern for few Euros.
Rgds
Raf