Product Chat / 2018.02.xx dx11 new public preview

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Earthling45
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Posted: 14th Feb 2018 21:53
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The thread was not started yet so i've opened it.

A big thanks to the Dev team, Lee, Preben and AmenMoses.

Going to test it with the village map again.
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Posted: 14th Feb 2018 22:20
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Hi all ,
anyone else getting severe nausea and visual disturbances after playing the new update for a bit ?
everything looks great and the visuals are all much sharper for sure and for me it runs super smooth
mostly,,,but found after about 5 - 10 minutes in the game.....vision was affected and started getting
a bit nauseated as if there was some kind of motion sickness inducing ocular stimulating activity going on.
Like some people get when they watch a 3d movie or get car sick watching scenery go by in a car.
I can usually play games for hours and 3d movies don't bother me at all.......maybe its just me...but
wanted to see if anyone else get this effect as they play the update..lemme know,,,,,

Thx

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Posted: 14th Feb 2018 22:23
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I do have a lot of older Multi textured models I notice don't work in the preview ..
They get darker as you go near them ... No biggie I know but I was wondering whether this would be fixed or whether Multi texturing was out now ?
The only person ever to get all his work done by "Friday" was Robinson Crusoe..
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Stab in the Dark software
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 00:08
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My first impression is that the lighting and shadows definitely look better
with out tweaking any of the settings.
The coffee is lovely dark and deep,and I have code to write before I sleep.
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 00:10
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Also noticed sometimes you put a character down .. Run test all ok ... Back the editor and he's invisible ?
You can still drag a box around where he was and delete him or he's still there in test game ..
Random thing not really repeatable which is annoying ..
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Jerry Tremble
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 01:44
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Quote: "Also noticed sometimes you put a character down .. Run test all ok ... Back the editor and he's invisible ?
You can still drag a box around where he was and delete him or he's still there in test game ..
Random thing not really repeatable which is annoying .."


Happened for me first try! And second try (new map, different character)! And third try (new map, different character)! So, I think it is indeed repeatable!
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 01:46 Edited at: 15th Feb 2018 19:10
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First 2 minutes into the new update and found some issues:

- enemy rocket explosions look weird
- enemy rocket trail smoke of rocket looks weird
- water looks strange
- characters still dont have visible colt or uzi in their hands

Good News:

- Animated decals are working and not crashing GG
- Blurring textures is fixed
- Skyboxes look much better for some reason (maybe cause of Anti-Alias ? is the shader active now by default?)

These were the two biggest issues for me with the previous PP, so awesome to see them fixed -- thanks to everyone involved!
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 02:01
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Quote: "So, I think it is indeed repeatable! "

I got it once ... then a little later got it again later...
When I say repeatable I mean I cannot deliberately do it which is what Lee would want to test it.
So lets hope it just happens to him
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Earthling45
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 02:13
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It is repeatable with EBE, i'll make a short video.
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 02:22
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Quote: "So lets hope it just happens to him "


Fingers crossed!
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Earthling45
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 02:56
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What happens in the video is quite repeatable at the first start up of Gameguru.
If i do it a second time, it remains visible after closing EBE, even when i choose a new level first.
As you can see, when i choose a entity for placement on the map, the EBE structure is visible again, this could well be the case with the characters too.

I've had it happening as well with characters but i believe that it was with the version before the first PP was released in December, so it is an old bug i think.
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 03:35 Edited at: 15th Feb 2018 04:44
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Hi all,
My first impression is that backward compatibility with .X models, has a way to go yet.

To demonstrate here are two screen shots of the exact same map from exactly the same position when loading game-test.

The map is being developed in the pre-DX11 version to test models for a Sci-Fi Space station I am working on.

Pic 1 - GG current release


Pic 2 - GG current Public Preview


To be fair I should note that the settings are not standard out of the box, in that I have tweaked them in Tab Tab, and have not changed anything in PP.

I may have a play with the settings later, but from experience with the previous PP I will not be able to stop the terrain reflections, which just look super weird on an interior ( edit: this is no issue now ). The floors however are not super shiny as they were in the previous PP so that is a start I guess....


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Earthling45
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 03:41
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There are a few remarks and a question which i have.

Quite noticeable is the improvement on EBE and other tiled entities with an atlas texture.
No more visible lines on the terrain, decals can be placed without a crash of the graphics driver.

So far so good, performance wise, it seems to be the same although i have not yet created a stand-alone file yet which i will do tomorrow.

Questions.
Will the height map be added to the PBR workflow?
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Earthling45
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 03:43
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Hi reliquia,

Try it with pbroverride=0

This can be set in the setup.ini.
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srun142
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 04:53
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Story Zone sound does not work with mp4 video (1920x1080 / 60fps / Video) and the video does not go smoothly
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 05:00 Edited at: 15th Feb 2018 05:01
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@Earthling45 Thanks for that - I was under the impression that the hope was to get both types of models working together so wanted to see how it looked without changing the setup_ini.

Here be some more pics with pbroverride=0.

Pic 1 - Current PP - Custom settings unchanged as before


Pic 2 - Current PP - Settings played with in Tab Tab


Interestingly the sun factor is turned off, and shadows set to 10 to get the results in the Current GG Release.

However to get rid of all that white-washing in PP I had to set the sunfactor to around 10 I think it was, and shadows to 2 so as to get an relatively even lighting on both sides of the corridor.
Turned brightness right down and contrast up 20 above brightness..

Other things I notice was that Illumination is much more subtle now, so may have to tweak the textures to get more brightness there.

Performance didn't seam to be any better for this map.

Overall I think this is a solid update over the last PP, so great work everyone!

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Preben
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 11:10 Edited at: 15th Feb 2018 11:19
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synchromesh:
Quote: "I do have a lot of older Multi textured models I notice don't work in the preview ..
They get darker as you go near them ... No biggie I know but I was wondering whether this would be fixed or whether Multi texturing was out now ?"


Fixed for next version, Added: PBR overwrite support for old multi textured models with no texture in fpe.

reliquia:
Do you have a texture= in the fpe ? , Anyway it looks like it somehow got inverted normals in the last screenshots, could you email it to me like to see what the problem is e-mail: plemsoft@plemsoft.com

Stab in the Dark software:
Quote: "My first impression is that the lighting and shadows definitely look better
with out tweaking any of the settings."


Yes looks like FXAA-CV-LS is on by default , I was also playing around with the new FXAA-CV-LS. This is a zoomed in screenshot from TBE demo , im just looking at the fence. using the new "#define SPLITTESTFXAACVLS" to do this split test ( and added a extra split to show the new effects ).

LEFT: is the old fxaa from the DX9 and the first PP, RIGHT: is the new FXAA-CV-LS in the PP02.


The normal "#define SPLITTESTFXAACVLS".


Teabone:
Quote: "- Skyboxes look much better for some reason"

Looks like the new FXAA-CV-LS is on by default

Attached some more that just use "#define SPLITTESTFXAACVLS" to see the differences.
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GraPhiX
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 11:59
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I have wiped my GG folder clean (backed up first) downloaded the new version all works fine but it will not download any store items I have purchased anyone else have this issue?
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 12:19
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Quote: "Fixed for next version, Added: PBR overwrite support for old multi textured models with no texture in fpe."

Brilliant thanks Preben ... I could have lived with it but would have lost a lot of models so this is a great option
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Preben
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 12:56
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Quote: "Brilliant thanks Preben ... I could have lived with it but would have lost a lot of models so this is a great option"

There is still some stock media in this format , so it was needed

Teabone:
Quote: "- Explosions look weird
- trail smoke of rocket looks weird"

Fixed:
Added: blending on particle/explosion/decals for better effects.
Removed: alpha clip on particle/explosion/decals , and moved it as a setting #define ENABLEDECALALPHACLIP (disabled by default).

The DX11 blending is WAY better then the DX9 , this should open up for some great effects. but it also fix all the old effects

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cybernescence
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 13:44
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@Preben

The new FXAA-CV-LS looks amazing as does the new alpha blending you've just added in the last hour .

Awesome work on the decal crashing issue too - thank you (20 hours! what a nightmare to find/fix.)
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Earthling45
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 15:23
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It certainly does look amazing.

It seems there really is an improvement in performance.
The above recording is with medium settings, but also on highest settings i get a decent 40 fps.

Shadows are quite dark on highest settings, when i put the slider at 33 it looks a lot better.
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Preben
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 15:27
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Earthling45:
Quote: "What happens in the video is quite repeatable at the first start up of Gameguru.
If i do it a second time, it remains visible after closing EBE, even when i choose a new level first.
As you can see, when i choose a entity for placement on the map, the EBE structure is visible again, this could well be the case with the characters too."

Fixed: EBE disappear when you click away from "builder" tab.

If you can find a way to also repeatedly show the characters disappearing that would be great , i have never seen it ?

cybernescence:
Quote: "20 hours! what a nightmare to find/fix"
\
Getting into all the "c" code takes some time , but im getting there

alpha blending: Try the old dust puff decal , and move as close to it as possible , you cant see a single pixel , now i dont have to tell you what that can be used for

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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 15:35
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Earthling45:
Yes shadows did not get any attention and there is for sure something to fix, but shadows is one of those things that takes a long time to get right, it might be a 2 week job , so think thats why it did not get fixed yet

Quote: "It certainly does look amazing."

Just try to look down on your terrain , your able to see all the small details in the textures
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 15:38
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I'm guessing the light mapping is still on hold but any news on Unlimited Dynamic lights ?
I know its possible with DX11 but is this way down the road ?
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Earthling45
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 16:07
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Quote: "Fixed: EBE disappear when you click away from "builder" tab."


I should have waited with the issue report i see, Preben your really fast.

I'm going try to find a way for the characters
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 16:47 Edited at: 15th Feb 2018 20:16
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That new FXAA shader is awesome. Gives a really sharp look ! PLEASE KEEP IT

Thanks for your work Preben, it is much appreciated !!


My "bug report" on the new public preview can be found here:
I still have the alpha issues...

https://github.com/TheGameCreators/GameGuruRepo/issues/71

the PP needs some fixes for sure, but it looks awesome ! Keep it up !
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Tarkus1971
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 18:41
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@Synchromesh - Yes unlimited dynamic lights would be great and the ability to move them with lua too, and if they could cast shadows on their own, without the sun shadowing, well, even more impressive
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 18:46 Edited at: 15th Feb 2018 20:15
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Quote: "and if they could cast shadows on their own, without the sun shadowing, well, even more impressive"


This is really crucial too In my opinion

I want this for christmas !!
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 18:55
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Disappearing Characters
1. The level started and played as usaual multiple times..
2. Then all of a sudden the skeleton characters where not
visible, only the sword they where carring approched
and attacked you.
3. The level was inside a dungeon/cave (PBR)
4. When I lead the skeletons through the dungen doorway
they started to reapear.. as soon as their legs hit the
terrain the legs appeared then the body then the head..
5. Anything that was at a height to obscure the dungeon model
was not drawn..terrain background see skeleton part
dungeon background no skeleton part shown..
6. Leading the skeletons back into the dungeon...
the full skeleton can be seen with the terrain background..
as soon as they enter the doorway the legs disappear..
and they go full invisible.. as the backgound is fully inside the dungeon..
7. Exit and save level - restart level and the skeletons are
back working ok -- but I am sure they will randomly dissapear again..

I hope this gives some extra clues to the cause or cure..
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Tarkus1971
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 19:01
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Download Store Items in the file menu NOT working I have some free stuff to download and I can't. This does not work if steam is running or not.

Anyone else got this problem.
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 19:16
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Quote: "Story Zone sound does not work with mp4 video (1920x1080 / 60fps / Video) and the video does not go smoothly"


I'm not sure if 60fps video format is supported? I believe its only 29/30. Someone will need to clarify.
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 20:10
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@Tarkus1971
I posted this morning and on Git Hub

Quote: "I have wiped my GG folder clean (backed up first) downloaded the new version all works fine but it will not download any store items I have purchased anyone else have this issue?"


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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 20:27
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thanks for the info Graphix.
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 20:32
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you can confirm the issue here please https://github.com/TheGameCreators/GameGuruRepo/issues/68 thanks Tarkus
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 21:05 Edited at: 16th Feb 2018 01:35
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where is the change log? I hear there are new LUA commands?
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 21:10 Edited at: 15th Feb 2018 21:11
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@J_C,

If this is happening on a saved map and is repeatable, you might want to send the map to Lee or Preben so they can test it and find a fix.

I've been busy with characters but so far without any success, they are and remain visible.
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 22:29
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@Teabone: Check global.lua, I added descriptions of the new commands to the end of it.
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Posted: 15th Feb 2018 22:56
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Quote: "reliquia:
Do you have a texture= in the fpe ? , Anyway it looks like it somehow got inverted normals in the last screenshots, could you email it to me like to see what the problem is e-mail: plemsoft@plemsoft.com "


Yes the fpe has the texture= line.

It is very probably my textures lol - been messing with various methods to try and work out the best\propper way to make them - so much confusing info on the web, and nothing really specific to GG - but me keep trying

Will email the map and models when I get home tonight.

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Posted: 16th Feb 2018 17:47 Edited at: 16th Feb 2018 17:48
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Has the private beta version been merged with the new PP? I'm assuming so as the blurry bug has been fixed. But weren't there new LUA commands in the private beta? What were/are those?
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Posted: 16th Feb 2018 18:08
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For the second time of asking, look at the end of global.lua.
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Posted: 16th Feb 2018 19:42 Edited at: 16th Feb 2018 19:49
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I'm talking about the Private Beta from the Closed Beta Discussion. Not Github merges nor previous to current PP merge. In the global.lua there is only your updates. I dont see any isolation or comment out areas for the BETA build from last year. I'm just going to assume what are new codes from them compared to the DX9 by trying them each out. For instance I'm talking about raising and lowering the water plain via LUA and things like that.

I think this is the issue with we are having with the terminology and so many different versions from the past floating about.

* Last Official Release (DX9)
* Private Closed Beta (not Github)
* Previous PP and Current PP and Github (all 3 confirmed merged)

I'm just wondering if the last two were merged. Which is essentially the merge of 4 version (excluding DX9)
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AmenMoses
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Posted: 16th Feb 2018 19:49 Edited at: 16th Feb 2018 19:52
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I haven't seen anyone adding new commands to GitHub, I've seen people saying that they have added stuff on forum posts but unless they are collaborators they will just be doing it for themselves. In fact I've got the latest code from GitHub and can confirm there are no new commands bar the ones I have added, so unless Lee is sitting on some changes that have yet to be committed there are no others in this current build.

As far as I am concerned the GitHub code IS the main repository, the Beta and PP builds are just a snapshot that Lee has deemed ready to put out into the wild so there shouldn't be anything in the PP or Beta builds that isn't already in GitHub. (If there is then we're doing it all wrong!)

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synchromesh
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Posted: 16th Feb 2018 20:06 Edited at: 16th Feb 2018 20:08
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Quote: "As far as I am concerned the GitHub code IS the main repository, the Beta and PP builds are just a snapshot that Lee has deemed ready to put out into the wild"

That's the way it is at the moment ...
The beta was updated earlier today as was the PP for a store download fix ..
Both the Beta and PP are identical
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Tarkus1971
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Posted: 16th Feb 2018 21:27
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I have yet to register on github, but I will soon. Looking forward to it. See what is new and might be arriving to GG soon.
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Earthling45
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Posted: 16th Feb 2018 23:09
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Quote: "Also noticed sometimes you put a character down .. Run test all ok ... Back the editor and he's invisible ?"


I've tried this with several characters but they remain visible when i close testmode and return to the editor.
Because it is still happening on your side i hope you can help Lee and Preben by finding a way to make it repeatable.
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dimoxinil
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Posted: 17th Feb 2018 10:14 Edited at: 17th Feb 2018 10:54
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Hi.

I've got a couple of qualms abour the PBR in GG. Perhaps I will receive an explanation later in this post.. or not.

What is the role of Alpha chanel in the normal maps?
Why some normal maps have 86 mb size when the rest of the textures of the object are 10MB? . (For example, Concrete Cylinder Graffiti)
The PBR maps avalible are Color, Ambient Oclusión, Gloss, Metalness and Normal, are there any more?
Are there roughness maps?
What is the role of Alpha chanel in the metalness maps?(For example, Barrel Rusty_metalness.dds).. may be roughness
Are there Auto ilumination maps (old _i.dds)?
Can I use SetShaderVariable in Lua to change the color of one obejct?

Thank you for your time.


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Belidos
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Posted: 17th Feb 2018 11:43
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With per you use either a roughness map or a gloss map, not both, they're slightly different (on a badic level theyre inverted versions of each other) but do a similar job. In gameguru the gloss map is actually a roughness map named gloss.

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dimoxinil
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Posted: 18th Feb 2018 19:44 Edited at: 18th Feb 2018 19:45
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Thank you very much for your detailed explanation Belidos. It has been very useful to me.

Here you have a screenshot of my early attempts to manage the GameGuru PBR.

As you can see, I still have a long way to go with the PBR.. but it's a start.



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synchromesh
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Posted: 18th Feb 2018 20:48
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Quote: "Here you have a screenshot of my early attempts to manage the GameGuru PBR."

If this means we have to wait longer for your game then the screenshots are rubbish

Seriously though ... That's god dam impressive ..
The only person ever to get all his work done by "Friday" was Robinson Crusoe..
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