Product Chat / GameGuru 2017.02.28 Progress Update

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AmenMoses
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Posted: 28th Feb 2017 21:59
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When I tested the Big Escape level this morning one of the RPG guys climbed right up on the big hill where the player can't get to and shot at me from there! That's just plain cheating!
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cybernescence
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Posted: 28th Feb 2017 22:01
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Yes the AI will run through water now - I'm working on a swimming update to the scripts for them (which we can do now that it is opened up to lua - yey!). More for the soldiers than the zombies


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Corno_1
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Posted: 28th Feb 2017 22:31 Edited at: 28th Feb 2017 22:36
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Quote: "I'm working on a swimming update to the scripts for them"

We should make a scripting thread where we collect all these "AI modification" so we must not search through a tons of threads when we sum them up, like Errant AI did it for FPSC. But maybe this is just a wish for a community project

Quote: "When I tested the Big Escape level this morning one of the RPG guys climbed right up on the big hill where the player can't get to and shot at me from there! That's just plain cheating!"

If he can shoot at you, you can shoot back(or did he shout through walls, this would be a bug) Or did you made a meele run This level was never a big challenge, but I will try again now


@Lee
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IndieFrell
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Posted: 28th Feb 2017 23:13
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Dvader
Quote: "Anyone else notice the fast zombies are insanely fast? To the point they run round you like bionic chickens"


Yes scared the living snot out of me, wasn't expecting them to come that quick at all, but an awesome update and my one level will be able to come on leaps and bounds now hopefully well when i get time in between working and surgery that is.
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AmenMoses
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Posted: 28th Feb 2017 23:32
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Just played BE again, this time three of the enemy ran away and hid, they were on the radar but I couldn't find them,
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MooKai
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Posted: 28th Feb 2017 23:33
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the classic characters not move... maybe they are on strike?
lee, please pay them more, that they go back to work...
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synchromesh
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 00:14
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Quote: "the classic characters not move... maybe they are on strike?"

You need to read back through ..... Myke explained this earlier
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Earthling45
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 02:57 Edited at: 1st Mar 2017 03:29
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Quote: "Everything I put in just stood around. the things that did move, just did their idle animations in the editor, but not when loading a test level. A few of the characters DID actually animate and attack, but only when I was right in front of them, and then if I got a few inches away, they went back to being frozen like statues."


I've changed the view cone angle and view range, then they work although i would like to have Rocketman fire at a longer range than he is currently.
I have to get quite close to him before he turns around and fires a rocket.

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geistschatten
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 03:50
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Whoa, the cubemap shader is amazing! Definitely a difference for metallic models! Here's my little test with the default cube texture. I was ready to scrap this model prior to the cube-mapping option, it just didn't look right.

On to exploring AI and third person more

Big thanks to Lee, Preben, and the rest of the GG team!

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OldFlak
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 10:55
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@geistschatten, wow looks heaps better with the reflection

No luck getting cube maps working myself, my model just looks darker - missing something obvious no doubt - lol

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geistschatten
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 11:22 Edited at: 1st Mar 2017 12:57
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@reliquia, Thanks! I nearly cried at how much of a difference it was to the "cartoony" feel since this was a model converted over from a Unity pack and looked shiny in Unity, like it now does in GG!

Not saying you did this, but I make the noobie mistake of not changing the shader in the FPE to cube_basic.fx entity_cube.fx instead of the standard entity_basic.fx during my first attempt with it.

Also I'm using the _CUBE texture from the Shiny Skull in the scenery folder, haven't had a shot at making my own... yet. I seem to remember something about including an alpha channel?

Lastly, the intensity is also controlled by the surface light, so if you have that at 0, nothing will show up.
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OldFlak
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 12:37
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@geistschatten. Thanks for the pointers

Yeah have double checked all those things a dozen times but to no avail.

The shiny skull fpe references 'entity_cube.fx' which I think is the new names for the cube map stuff, but have tried them both. Have put all the files in the same folder for my model as well. I must be doing the alpha thing wrong I guess but how I don't know - yet, lol.

But glad you got your model sorted m8

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geistschatten
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 12:59
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You're right, sorry, I was thinking of the beta shader.

The only other thing I can think of is if you're using a multi-texture? Not sure on the compatibility with that.
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Belidos
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 13:10
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Quote: "Yeah have double checked all those things a dozen times but to no avail. "


When you saved the _cube.dds you did select to save as a cube map right? That's the mistake I made, I created my cube map by editing the stock one then just chose to overwrite it, and in GIMP overwriting doesn't save the cube mapping.

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Stab in the Dark software
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 14:29
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Lightmapping is causing entities to vanish. they reappear when switching to realtime lighting.
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GraPhiX
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 14:34 Edited at: 1st Mar 2017 14:44
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Quote: "Lightmapping is causing entities to vanish. they reappear when switching to realtime lighting"


I also have this issue plus lightmapping removes the EBE textures and makes them black again seems to be random, when I close GG and restart they are textured again if I lightmap again its random which EBE loses texture.
The textures seem to swap about with different buildings too if I manually fix them from all being black whatever I change on one EBE site changes on another, I thought each site was independent and you could have 16 textures on each is this not the case have I got it wrong?

quick video changed textures on billboard textures inside house also change

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geistschatten
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 21:35 Edited at: 1st Mar 2017 22:00
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@Belidos, Thank you for mentioning that, I never knew that was an option in GIMP! Now off to make some new cubemaps

Edit: Custom cubemap only showed up a little bit when I turned up the Surface Level to max. Is there a trick for making these show up better on the model like that default Skull one does?
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3com
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 21:41 Edited at: 1st Mar 2017 21:41
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@ Lee
I was testing zombies in my level.
They are quite more agressive now, even thru the water, jumping, up levels, stairs, and son, cool.

Most of then going thru the floor when death, I think this is because the gravityOff when died, (ragdoll and so on).
But they also does when alive, I'm going to post the video here if you want to take a look.



So now the question:

Quote: "In both modes entities automatically avoid obstacles and other entities in their current container when moving about, without a need for a separate collision system. However, dynamic obstacles such as crates should not be added to the AI system, instead use an external collision/physics system to detect collisions with dynamic obstacles and use AI Set Entity Collide. "


Where this LUA command "AI Set Entity Collide" sit? I was looking for, even in global.lua, But I can not find it, maybe it's a future command for next release?

The quoted above sound really nice here.

Thanks in advance

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MooKai
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 21:57
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3com, thats a cool doom style level
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OldFlak
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Posted: 1st Mar 2017 23:28
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Thanks for the tips guys - appreciated.

Quote: "The only other thing I can think of is if you're using a multi-texture? Not sure on the compatibility with that."


I am using a single texture.

Quote: "When you saved the _cube.dds you did select to save as a cube map right? That's the mistake I made, I created my cube map by editing the stock one then just chose to overwrite it, and in GIMP overwriting doesn't save the cube mapping."


Yeah haven't got that far yet - lol, just using the one that comes with Game Guru for the shiny Scull.

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Earthling45
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 01:39
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The name of the model and textures are the same?

model.x
model_CUBE.dds
model_D.dds and so on.

In the FPE point to model_D as the diffuse texture and change entity_basic.fx to entity_cube.fx

Load model_S in paint.net or gimp and add alpha.

This is how i did it with the door and it worked with using the cube map of the scull after adding other pictures to the cube map.
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 02:49 Edited at: 2nd Mar 2017 02:50
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@Earthling45. Thanks for the tips.

Double checked all those things, a dozen times too - still no luck.

I guess it is to do with the _S, but no matter what I do, I still be missing something - lol

I use photoshop, but even if I save the _S as DTX1 with no alpha, and open it in Gymp, gymp thinks it has an alpha channel anyway, and if I save it out using Gymp with settings recommended by Pyrate Myke in this thread I still have no reflection.

Also tried just saving the _S as a png, opened it in gymp, right clicked and added alpha channel and save as dds with above mentioned compression - but no joy.

I get the same results in test game.

Might just try another model but I get the impression that I am just not getting this alpha thing - lol

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Pirate Myke
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 02:53
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The _S file needs to have an alpha channel and saved with dxt5 compression if using a .dds file.
.png files I would have to test.

You can email me your files and I can check them out if you would like. Email me at myke1net at hotmail.com
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 03:53 Edited at: 2nd Mar 2017 09:19
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Quote: "The _S file needs to have an alpha channel and saved with dxt5 compression if using a .dds file.
.png files I would have to test.

You can email me your files and I can check them out if you would like. Email me at myke1net at hotmail.com"


Thanks Pyrate Myke, yeah I am not using png in gg just dds, and dxt5 was the compression I thought would have been correct, and have also tried - but yeah.

Will persevere some more, but may send the files to you later!

EDIT: will shelve this for the time being, spent the whole day trying to get it to work - must be my noobness at adding alpha chanels in photoshop (damn I thought I had that worked out lol)

Thanks for your help all.

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MooKai
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 08:35
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Update... Classic characters are not on strike anymore, thank you Lee.
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3com
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 17:04
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@ MooKai
Glad you like it.

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DVader
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 17:30
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Getting some fairly bonkers AI issues myself. I've made a quick map to test them and as soon as it loads up, all I have to do is stand still and wait, a zombie will come running in and run around you in circles, really fast. This can trigger a repeating sound at times. If you hang about dodging them they eventually stop attacking at all and default to idle. They still can warp about and moonwalk, also still hit you from silly distances when they do so.

Here's a link to the map in case anyone wants to test and see if it behaves the same way on their setup.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/52565492/crazy%20ai.zip


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Sulman
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 18:33
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Good job... I love this update...
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lordjulian
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 18:42 Edited at: 2nd Mar 2017 19:07
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I don't know if I'm doing something wrong but the AI now seems worse than ever. The player can walk right up to the characters from behind and push into them and they just stand there. You can fire a weapon close to them and they do nothing. They seem deaf. If you get them to respond, sometimes all you need to do is walk round behind them and they forget you are there. I can't get them to use the stairs. Sometimes they run on the spot or spin around. I've tried uzi soldier and combat soldier. The characters made in the character creator don't work at all. In 3rd person the reticule can aim in the opposite direction to where the player is facing. I like the new close-up combat moves but the rest is seriously disappointing.
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3com
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 19:36
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I know there are another ways to get what I'm looking for, but that's not the matter here, matter here is waypoint does not work on my level, and I would like to know why, in order to fix it.

About waypoints, I don't get it working. Using last buid now, anaway it does not as well, when using previews build.

I do not use often wp, but my last models/level I'm working on, need wp to move from point A to point B. (easiest way for me )

So, IIRC I should click on create waypoint button on main toolbar, and the wp should appears in some place (would be nice it appearing where I do lmb click), but it does not, I was looking for the wp around all my map with not to avail, in previews version a found it under water.

Even I've tried clicking on edit waypoint mode button, but it doe no make the difference, I can found it.

I've made a video to show you better the issue, now it is uploading to yt, waiting for..... post in realtime...



somebody knows where is my wp?

ok, ok, I'm going to move the house, who knows, maybe..

Nope, nothing there.



And the very odd here is than it works fine in a blank map, so why doesn't in my map?

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Belidos
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 21:03
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Quote: "So, IIRC I should click on create waypoint button on main toolbar, and the wp should appears in some place (would be nice it appearing where I do lmb click), but it does not, I was looking for the wp around all my map with not to avail, in previews version a found it under water."


Press G and it should be directly underneath you.

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3com
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 21:16
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Quote: "Press G and it should be directly underneath you."


Belidos you are right, thanks for the tip.

So, better works with wp in top view mode.

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lordjulian
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 22:29
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Does anyone know how to use floor zones? And how to get characters to use stairs?
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Honkeyboy
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2017 22:59
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Im still having trouble with waypoints there again ive never got waypoints to work lol i press G put the waypoint down put a character on the wapoint = stands there and does nothing, ok i relay the waypoint on an already laid character = same result, ok...i lay a waypoint down and it turns green oo is that it = nope still doesn't move along the waypoint. Not saying im confused like cos i proper am :/? I know its probably me as i never have got waypoints to work since i started but it really would be nice to know how to do this properly and or if my GG install is up the swannie :/
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 00:27
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This is what helped me thanks to 'synchromesh' . I had the same problem.

https://forum.game-guru.com/thread/217360#msg2573594
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Preben
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 08:17
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Cube map confusing , i made some samples about how to use cube map here:

https://forum.game-guru.com/thread/217589

best regards Preben Eriksen,
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synchromesh
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 08:54
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Quote: "Does anyone know how to use floor zones? And how to get characters to use stairs?"

Characters seem to automatically use stairs and chase me on 2nd levels .....
Not sure what the actual floor zone is for if I'm honest ?
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Honkeyboy
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 09:53
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Thanks Lance for pointing that out and cybernescence for spotting it, i thought i'd changed it but couldn't have saved (must have been late) all seems to be working now
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devlin
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 11:08
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The floor zone should act as a nave mesh.
you will notice it now has 4 points to drag .
holding shift while mouse on any point will add
another point, i guess this might be so you can make
more shapes like going round corners ect.
well that is what a nav mesh does i ? think it
does, or should do.
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AmenMoses
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 11:56
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Navmesh is just a coding technique. The floor zone is simply a set of coordinates defining an area, Lee may have used a navmesh algorithm or he may have come up with something entirely from his own imagination, maybe he'll explain it in a broadcast at some point.
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cybernescence
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 15:09
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The floor zone nav nesh constrains the AIs that start out placed within that zone to that zone, so you can have AIs that don't move across your entire map if you don't want them to or don't go beyond building boundaries and such like.

You can connect the zones using way point paths too (for tightly defined travel paths between wide open zones), and the zones can be at different heights.


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lordjulian
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 16:09
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OK. Thanks for the info on Floor Zones. I seem to be having a very different experience of the new AI than some of you. My characters are avoiding stairs and often seem both deaf and blind.
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AmenMoses
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 16:24
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On the MMS level the RPG guys start firing before they have even seen me, the soldiers are all facing away from me (makes them easy to shoot though) and the uzi guys just seem to stand still, makes for an interesting play but I can't really say it's any harder. When I got to the bit with the tunnel going to the right with a couple of RPG guys hiding around the corner they retreated up the hill, ran around behind me and came into the tunnel from the other end! Thing is the player can't climb that darn hill but they can.
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geistschatten
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 16:26
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@Preben, Thank you for explaining how the shaders work in that other thread. I've had much better success with using my custom cubemap texture now

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Tarkus1971
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 18:29
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Editor still jerky, when entity, marker or light attached to mouse, ok on reasonably sized map. If i select grass painting mode, editor speeds up, select marker, light or entity to place, editor is stuttery and slow again.
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Tarkus1971
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 18:39
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OK i just found out why the editor is jerky

in the setup file in the gameguru folder change

disablesurfacesnap=0

to

disablesurfacesnap=1

reload GG and all is good again. Everything seems smoother.
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Anubis
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 18:59 Edited at: 3rd Mar 2017 19:03
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Empty map - open entities, characters, pick one (stock soldier) and place character.. i have to wait around 5-10 seconds for the map to appear again and show my character to be placed.

PS.. second character goes a lot quicker.. probably the engine starting up when placing the first.. so no biggie here.
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Tarkus1971
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 19:08
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yes it seems 1st entity placed in map takes ages here too.
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Pirate Myke
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 19:09
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I can verify that also.
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3com
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2017 19:20
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Quote: "I can verify that also"

Same here.

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