Product Chat / Feature Vote!

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MooKai
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Posted: 18th Jul 2015 18:58
@dimoxinil
hahaha, I'm also waiting for this, since... lightyears
Old school FPS fan, DOOM!!! Why GG not working on my AMIGA 500?
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Teabone
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Posted: 18th Jul 2015 20:32 Edited at: 19th Jul 2015 01:54
Quote: "I want GG to be what it was ment to be and that is and easy game creator. "


Considering its roots... when GG was in its actual alpha stages as Reloaded; the primary debate was the push for LUA support. The strategic marketing move to Game Guru "The easy game maker" has completely shifted the roots of the engine. This has generated a different direction for the engine than what it was originally purposed to be. Granted there are more people out there looking for an easier way to make games.

Most of us paid more than what GG is worth now for a product that changed half way in development. However, many of the original supporters are still here, thankfully. That is why extended LUA support is in the top 3 voted items. Most of the items on the list are do-able with more LUA commands. As I have posted before it won't take much to get vehicles working:



Day and Night can be down by controlling all the various lighting ambiance and colors and skybox via LUA. I think what most people fear is that most of these items wont become available to people unless they bought them off of users from the store. That is why I hope TGC will provide some stock scripts for each item in the list. Keeping them hard-coded would make them difficult or impossible for the community to improve or modify.
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Corno_1
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Posted: 18th Jul 2015 21:52
Give us coders lua commands. I promise you will not regret it
In three weeks, I have 3 months of free time and what is a better task to create scripts for the community for FREE.
With enought lua commands I can recreate anything on the list(exept graphic improvements) and even better than hard coded in the engine. And if not there are many other talented scripters in this forum like smallg or nullptr!....

Vote for LUA
My dream is to develope games, which makes fun when I create it and fun when other people play it.
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synchromesh
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Posted: 18th Jul 2015 22:03
At first I was kind of worried how the voting system would work and what would be voted for.
But right now its looking like all the features are in the right places ( meaning near the top ) Obviously there can only be one at a time but if there all hovering in the right area we should be in for a great ride ..... Once this update is out the way of course
The only person ever to get all his work done by "Friday" was Robinson Crusoe..
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Teabone
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Posted: 19th Jul 2015 01:51
By the way I have nothing against people that sell scripts and I don't think that should ever end. There are some great quality well scripted work there. I just would love to see some examples ones in the future from TGC; so i can learn from them That is all lol
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JackalHead
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Posted: 19th Jul 2015 04:13
Mm ya dont go by my current tag. I've been here since reloaded. I am a gold backer, so I know what has changed etc. I've been waiting on this product just like every other old timer for years. It has always been the easy game maker. That was sort of the slogan. So switching to GG hasnt changed anything other then now its rebranded. We will all just have to wait and see what happens to GG.
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Teabone
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Posted: 19th Jul 2015 08:37 Edited at: 19th Jul 2015 08:50
Trust me I've been following FPS Creator for quite a long time too...

The tagline was quite recent , around the same time as the steam launch. It was actually one of the most concerning aspects of the re-branding for most of us. As it was kind of the wake up call that this might not be the advanced engine we were following since prior the Kickstarter and there-after. Which may be ironic to many, as it doesn't sound like a negative thing at all. I could care less now though as this is the way its going to be and it brings in a whole lot of new users to the community. I'm just glad the the voting system is reflecting the community very well (old/new).
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3com
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Posted: 19th Jul 2015 11:32
The very long vote feaure list just is telling me, there is many work to do.

I want improve LUA too, but this does no help "directly" to non scripter users, who maybe want a "scriptbank" with all sort of pre-builded lua function ready to be use, if GG want to be a "easy game maker".

Fortunately we have very good scripters on board, and I can attest to their skill and generosity.

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synchromesh
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Posted: 19th Jul 2015 12:25
Quote: "The very long vote feaure list just is telling me, there is many work to do."


There are bound to be features that will only take Lee a couple of days to implement so he might ( and only might ) get on with the next on the list as well ..
I cant see him adding a feature then releasing it 3 days later ..... But I might be wrong ..

Either way I don't think its going to take as long as we think
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snowdog
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Posted: 20th Jul 2015 19:17
Good to see the votes in the list looking more like I was hoping/expecting. A Save/Load system is essential imo if you want to create a professional looking game, same goes for AI on different levels and indoors.

And of course Occlusion being sorted will give a good performance boost even after the next performance boosting update has come and gone.

Very happy with the way voting is going at the moment.
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Tarkus1971
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Posted: 20th Jul 2015 21:27
We need an ability to allow the player to slide on steep angles. say a great big slab entity angled, for example in a platform game you could set up steep incline to slide down but not be able to climb up. Great for long fast slides and opens up stuff for more types of games too.
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Teabone
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Posted: 21st Jul 2015 02:40 Edited at: 21st Jul 2015 02:44
Quote: "We need an ability to allow the player to slide on steep angles. say a great big slab entity angled, for example in a platform game you could set up steep incline to slide down but not be able to climb up. Great for long fast slides and opens up stuff for more types of games too."


I agree with this completely. I emailed Lee and Rick the idea as its the only way i can further my vehicle prototype.

An example of how it works in theory:



Here is a simple 2D game engine making use of slopes on the front end (user end):



I've not used AGK as I'm not a very good programmer but I'm sure it uses some slope methods as well.
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!nullptr
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Posted: 21st Jul 2015 03:20
Quote: "I think what most people fear is that most of these items wont become available to people unless they bought them off of users from the store. That is why I hope TGC will provide some stock scripts for each item in the list. "

As a non-modeller, would I get a refund on the DLC's? The 100s of items I bought from the store?

Let's not forget that corno, smallg and myself (as the late comer) drop most of our script for free anyway and with literally 100's of pieces of free script available already it's just up to the game developer to sort it into 1 cohesive piece - THAT'S the hard part and this can never been done via the store or free. (and completely refutes this "no coding" fairytale tbh)

Alas, regardless of whether it's paid or free, corno hit the nail on the head. Give the scripters the goods and ye' shall be rewarded.

eg:
- Save/Load was/is a waste of time without something as simple as ammo count. It's a waste of time unless/until we get dynamic entities. (We can't even drop an entity without a coded workround atm).
- D/N is a waste of time without being able to modify light position and skybox.
- Inventory. For everything people are promising, it's very difficult to make a PnP script without knowing in advance what users intend to do because HOW something is handled has to be either fixed or much coding is needed at user end.

The list is much longer but these will suffice as good examples of the most asked for. So much is possible, some of it will be impossible (or very difficult) regardless of what we get/don't get and people need to remember that while modelling is set and forget static objects, script is not only dynamic in operation, it is also dynamic in design.

Users can ask for and plug in all the PnP script they want but without an all encompassing design and a handle on how it all comes together they'll just create a massive bug fest and performance slam in addition to everybody's game acting exactly the same as everyone elses (pretty much).

First we need to dispense with the "coding free" mindset and from that we're left with an immediate demand for LUA so the coders can work the magic everybody desires - either by you or for you. It will also need some serious scripting knowledge improvement by potential non-coding game developers - that's a reality.

imho, there is no silver bullet PnP game design engine - never will be - but we can get close.

Vote #1 >> LUA
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synchromesh
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Posted: 21st Jul 2015 03:27 Edited at: 21st Jul 2015 03:30
Quote: " agree with this completely. I emailed Lee and Rick the idea as its the only way i can further my vehicle prototype.
"


At the bottom of the voting page you will see a suggest feature ...
https://www.game-guru.com/feature-vote

Please use this to suggest new features and keep things fair ....
We all wanted a system where we could have our say and now we have it
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Old Larry
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Posted: 23rd Jul 2015 08:11 Edited at: 23rd Jul 2015 08:41
In my opinion most important is:
1 - the water system (different high from water)
2 - Variable map sizes (small maps will decrease the used resources)
3 - Stand alone (non steam) multiplayer game
4 - Save-Load progress
5 - Climbing ladders
6 - AI-Animals (attack dogs and others)
7 - Destructible windows glasses, doors, walls or fences
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Peregrinus
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Posted: 31st Jul 2015 14:59 Edited at: 8th Aug 2015 02:15
edited.
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Old Larry
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 13:16
And a BODY for player will be nice too. If the player want to view hes foots...nothing ...maybe he is a ghost one ?!?
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MooKai
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 14:03
Hahaha yes, a body would be nice. Or are we ghosts?
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3com
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 15:29
Yeah, yeah!!! like this one....





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MooKai
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Posted: 5th Aug 2015 15:41 Edited at: 5th Aug 2015 15:42
Hmm ahh... No....

Old school FPS fan, DOOM!!! Why GG not working on my AMIGA 500?
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Dralel
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Posted: 8th Aug 2015 05:50
You can already have a viewable body by making or editing the HUD.X file.
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DVader
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Posted: 8th Aug 2015 06:45 Edited at: 8th Aug 2015 06:46
I made a body script ages ago. It's in the scripts forum if you care to look



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Dralel
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Posted: 8th Aug 2015 23:51
Is there an updated version to your body script to include the crouch animation, and cleaned up the script file? Seems like a good start though!
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granada
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Posted: 9th Aug 2015 21:02
When work on the top vote be started,will we get a progress report on work .

Dave
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synchromesh
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Posted: 9th Aug 2015 23:24
Yes Lee's Blog will keep us updated on the progress as usual
The only person ever to get all his work done by "Friday" was Robinson Crusoe..
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Old Larry
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Posted: 10th Aug 2015 12:18 Edited at: 10th Aug 2015 12:19
DVader wrote: "I made a body script ages ago. It's in the scripts forum if you care to look "

Indeed was a great script. For now that script put the body player in the ground at hes knees,
and I can't make it to stay at ground level.
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smallg
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Posted: 11th Aug 2015 22:50
at line 99 there's the line
Quote: "bodyy = g_PlayerPosY"

add something to it to make the body higher
like
bodyy = g_PlayerPosY + 30
life\'s one big game

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Old Larry
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Posted: 15th Aug 2015 19:11 Edited at: 15th Aug 2015 19:30
smallg wrote: "add something to it to make the body higher
like
bodyy = g_PlayerPosY + 30"


Perfect !
Now I must guess the best settings for animation so I can make this body walk (for the moment his feet just slide)...
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Titantropo
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Posted: 17th Aug 2015 13:10
I think all the smaller/faster features to add should come first. Why? Let's suppose it takes the team 3 months to do a huge/important feature, till it works perfectly. Then, a smaller one is added and ruins the huge one. 3 months down the drain. And if a feature that only took 3 hours to make is ruined, it will take less time to correct.

Of course that, even If I'm not a coder, I'm aware that sometimes it's quite the opposite, but I'm sure most times it will be like this.
Here, there and everywhere.
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Noktavian
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Posted: 18th Aug 2015 00:42
I don't know what kind of halucinagenic the people who voted on the top things were on, yet I don't see how most of them are going to benifet the engine more than the ones that would have actually been useful. So, we will be able to have 1 million lights, as well as 1 foliage type per map. We will be able to save and load games, yet not have any progress of the character.

everything I wanted to see implemented has gone the way of the wind due to everyone only seeing this as a FPS software. It can be so much more than a single player/multiplayer map game. Even if inventory and crafting you think should be RPG related, I actually hope to put together a game similar in the fashion as Defiance and others of that sort. Everything that would have brought customization and depth to the software was overlooked for a few pretty bells and whistles.

At this point I've been building levels because I have nothing close to what I need to fully make an actual game that isn't just point and shoot.

I really am sad, that in the year 2015 people still see shooters as only something like a cheap Call of Duty rip off.

Well that's how I feel,

Have a nice day
So when you said jump, did you mean now
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synchromesh
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Posted: 18th Aug 2015 02:12 Edited at: 18th Aug 2015 02:12
Quote: "everything I wanted to see implemented has gone the way of the wind due to everyone only seeing this as a FPS software."


No its what users want first ... How is "Load and saving" your game for FPS users only ?
and that's what the Voting System is all about ...
The most requested feature at one point was the voting system .... And here it is ..

Remember your post here ...
https://forum.game-guru.com/thread/211103#msg2510938

Well we have third person ... Problem is we cannot please everyone all of the time
The only person ever to get all his work done by "Friday" was Robinson Crusoe..
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Scene Commander
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Posted: 18th Aug 2015 08:32
@Noktavian

I'm sorry that you feel features you'd like aren't being given a priority, but we are an openly lead development team and we are focusing on the needs and desires of the majority of our users.

I'm sure we will get around to everything that everyone wants, but if you can think of a more democratic system of meeting the needs of our users than an open and free vote we'd be very happy to hear your suggestions.

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nuncio
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Posted: 18th Aug 2015 10:21
there are lots of things to do but i think load and save come right after the performance update. i'm happy with GG for i paid a small price and got a big thing to play with for months. i got everything back i put in multiple times with the competetions. really happy with this so far.
i think the best, really worth mentioning update was the free flight mode. this really changed GG and made it much better. this was the best idea until now i think.
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Noktavian
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Posted: 18th Aug 2015 13:36
@Scene Commander

It isn't that I don't believe in people receiving the type of updates and features that will make life easier for the software. Quite simply stated, this is no longer the community that has been here the whole time. Because of sales on things like Humble Bumble, and continuous clearance sales on steam (which is one of the smartest things I've heard of) yet it invites people from all age groups and all types of maturity. The way the vote is setup is confusing to most people who don't know that each line has an explaination for it in the text of the name if scrolled over.

In addition to that, most people, would only vote on the things that most interest them, and leave any and all that they either do not understand the purpose or the usage of certain things empty. Meaning, the things they think they want the most would receive a five, while 1's all around for the things that are less important to them.

It is a scued voting system, and democracy is fine, until the voters can not understand the ballet.
So when you said jump, did you mean now
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Peri
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Posted: 20th Aug 2015 13:27
for me its:

Third Person Mode for any character
Day & Night system
save&load
the ability to reset all the dead enemies when you back to check point
and main menu easy build

Lance
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Posted: 20th Aug 2015 18:38
Haven't been doing much here since the 'enemies' have to stick to ground level . Most of my projects require the 'enemies' to follow player to upper levels of buildings or just walk on upper levels . So , I just wait....
At least it's good MC weather around here .

Lance
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Old Larry
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Posted: 20th Aug 2015 20:39
The engine must be faster and
the maps must can be resized to smallest.
See the video below please. No one of AI enemies present and no one special atmosphere in game...
Just the map, few non animated trees, sounds and all of entities or assets is static (no one dynamic).

Smile today, tomorrow could be worse

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AceRimmer
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Posted: 26th Sep 2015 16:43
Suggestion for the Developers:

As some features take a lot more work and time than others, would it be at all possible for you to indicate on suggested features how quick/simple they are for you to do.
It might have an important bearing on how people vote on minor features if they knew that something might be in the game in hours or days rather than after weeks or months of work.
For example it might be that the bots navigating heights and stairs (currently top of the list) will take a lot longer to do than something like water at different heights. It would be nice if you incorporated any of the minor suggestions that you could easily slot in along the way.
Ideally we'd all be voting for the major features and see some of the minor features coming along at the same time. People would see regular new small features and incrimental improvements in between the major updates.

Democracy eh
Maurehago
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Posted: 28th Sep 2015 19:50
Everyone has different priorities.
There are plenty of good futures in the list, and some of them I would already need.
It is therefore difficult to agree on the next point.

Would not it be better to start at the beginning?
Everyone must learn to go first, befor can run.

What's the first thing you do with the Game Guru?

I think it is to create a level.
Create terrain and then placing, move, modify, adapt, search, select and delete models.

More Layer the terrain, with better transition.
Vegetative generator.

A grid system, enter coordinates, grouping, preflabs or blueprints import formats from other 3D programms.
Materials, multi textures
Models placing depend con other models.
Bulk import with placing models.

Who wants make a good level, must first create one.
With more help there are the faster it goes.

I'd start at the beginning to optimize.

As Engine Developer, that would be my priority list:

1) Terrain
2.) Model import placing
3.) materials, textures
3.) Character
4.) wappons
5.) Logic
6) Build Test Games
7) optimization
8.) Futures

Start over backwards.
In construction, a solid foundation, is also built first.

PS:
sorry for my bad english
Pirate Myke
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Posted: 28th Sep 2015 20:55
Yes, it might be, but has not worked out in the past.

Since implementing the voting features, there have been zero flame posts on what should be or not. It is all out in the open right now for every one to see the results and what is being worked on.

Lee's blog is also very informative as to where the progress is on the features being added.

https://www.game-guru.com/devblog/
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MXS
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Posted: 29th Sep 2015 03:22
I personally don't agree with the voting at all. we have been given to many features to vote for at once. there is no real order for the features to be place in the engine. I think Lee should do what's best at this stage of the engine because what would have make more sense is to work on the performance feature that is on the voting broad now. since he is working on that anyway it would be good to get the Tree batching and Hardware Instancing done. because once we all start dropping trees in our level with the new c++ version of guru we will kill the performance easy because there is no real optimization for the trees we put down. the new guru update draw calls will still be too high and that means all that performance gain be lost quick. guru will not be able to handle a larger grid then it have now without the right optimization features like Rendering distance for static meshes and Occlusion. these should be put in without a vote. the scifi pack should also not be put to a vote. it should be added in when it is ready. bullet tracer should put without a vote it should be added in when the scifi pack is ready. Infinite Terrain and Variable Map Sizes should be taken down until we have full optimization with the map size we have now. meaning with graphic Effects like blur ,light rays and bloom. we will also have see how guru holds up with shader 5.0 and right now the weapon hud takes to many draw calls as well. so there is a lot work that needs to be before even trying to do the things on the voting now. for this performance to hold against other effects and feature it needs to deal with the ones we have now. I know everyone will disagree to this but after you put down 100 trees in the level the frame rate number will drop fast because of the lack of optimization for the trees draw calls. it does not matter how much speed get or even if we had a 1000 frame start with on a blank level. it matters how much less we use of draw call or the less that guru renders at once which will make guru handle more with less.
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Teabone
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Posted: 29th Sep 2015 04:18 Edited at: 4th Oct 2015 09:08
Interesting how much the votes have changed over time
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Posted: 29th Sep 2015 07:52 Edited at: 29th Sep 2015 07:53
I think before you all jump to the assumption that we WON'T be adding certain features, you should wait until you see the next couple of builds.

I'm not sure where the idea that you won't be getting batch rendering, occlusion or the many other features we read we won't be adding are coming from. All of these things are planned and a lot of them do need to be done before we can move forward.

Some were added to the voting system, but may need to be moved up the list before we can progress regardless of the public vote.

Please, wait and see and I'm sure you'll be very pleased with the results.

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Posted: 29th Sep 2015 13:41
I never said those features will not be added. it is the fact that those features on the voting board and they could be added now with the performance update instead of waiting for us to vote it up. the voting board stands as is and everyone has there own priority list that is not going to help for those performance feature to be added any time soon. we all know what is on the top list on the voting board.
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smallg
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Posted: 29th Sep 2015 17:54
i kinda agree that some of the more basic stuff should be added without needing a vote (such as copy and paste box selection!!) and then we should be voting on actual "features" (such as more third person, vehicles, quests etc)
but i guess we shall see what happens once they start
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MXS
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Posted: 29th Sep 2015 18:58
yes smallg that is the way I'm looking at it. Lee is already doing research on the performance features that I have said so it only make good sense to add it in being the fact he is in the core of the engine now. I am willing to wait for all of this now then wait later for Lee to go back and forth with the performance features that could have been already done now. i rather have a complete optimize engine in the next update instead of trying push other features in before it. like I said trees will eat up the performance gain we got from the c++ conversion. draw call will still be too high for the engine to handle a lot of model on the level at one time. for every same object like a box you can put five of those boxes in your level and guru will draw call five boxes. but with the new optimization feature if you put five of those boxes down guru will use one draw call. things like this should have to be voted on as it will be a better gain for the performance and optimize large levels. as for the scifi pack it should added when ready like the other packs was.
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LeeBamber
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Posted: 19th Nov 2015 13:10
As you can see, democracy is not a perfect instrument, but at least it has the virtue of being more representative of what you want than might be produced from a dictatorial approach. Naturally there will be a number of features further down the list that are related in some way to ones at the top, and other features that get implemented because they're easy and quick to do, but generally I think the community have voted correct. The Load/Save might seem like a 'horse has bolted' feature, but in order to implement it properly we are overhauling the LUA system (which will store the values for saving) which means a myriad of small commands that will bring big contributions from the community. The second feature is AI, which is probably the biggest request we've received after performance and graphics. Who knows whether the voting system will be as effective long term, but I am happy with the early signs and am willing to give it the time it needs to find its feet.

Another benefit of the 'LUA Architecture' work is that by externalising the hard coded elements of the engine, and exposing every possible in-game value to the scripters, you no longer need to wait on the core team to add a new feature. The next generation of LUA script will allow any third party to configure both the behavior of the script, but also a front-end editor GUI so other users can make use of the script but set specific attibutes from the editor, as easily as using the current widget panel. This means pioneering members of the community can browse the voting board and have a go at supporting a requested feature using the enhanced LUA command set (we have a LOT of commands planned).

Having browsed the voting board just now, I can also see we have in fact completed the OCCLUSION feature too, so that's already two birds with one stone. I also noticed a few features that where relatively quick to implement (less than a day) so they may also be included in one of the micro-updates to come in the next few weeks. So think of our voting board as a kind of democracy with a touch of common sense and over 3 decades of game development experience to ensure the decision is sound.
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3com
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Posted: 27th Nov 2015 10:50
Quote: "(we have a LOT of commands planned)"

Not a great scripter here, but that sounds like music to my ears.

Would be nice player having the chance to entry in some kind of "player mouse control mode" when required, ie: entry password to open door.

* player go close to the door
* prompt "E" and so on
* If "E" then, "player mouse control mode" activate, player freeze, player takes the mouse control, hit the numbers in console
* if player enter correct pass/cancel operation, so door open, "engine mouse control mode" activate, unfreeze player, and continue.

Just a idea.

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LeeBamber
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Posted: 27th Nov 2015 16:15
@3com : Yes we have all those commands now implemented and will be in the Beta version for this weekend. We are on the same page me thinks!
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3com
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Posted: 27th Nov 2015 22:36
Nice to know.
Thanks for all the hard work, you and team.

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