Product Chat / Your thoughts on the shooting mechanics at the moment

Author
Message
DVader
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 28th Jan 2004
Location:
Posted: 10th Aug 2014 14:50
Hi all. Here's a quick video showing my frustration with reloaded's shooting mechanics.



Feel free to agree, disagree and generally discuss what we feel is right for Reloaded's future updates in regard to accuracy and above all range.



SPECS: Q6600 CPU. Nvidia 260GTX. 8 Gig Memory. Win 7.
Wolf
Forum Support
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Nov 2007
Location: Luxemburg
Posted: 10th Aug 2014 14:51
It feels like a placeholder to me. ... probably is.

"When I contradict myself, I am telling the truth"

"absurdity has become necessity"
Duncan Peck
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 25th Apr 2014
Location:
Posted: 10th Aug 2014 15:00 Edited at: 10th Aug 2014 15:02
I see your point after watching the video. I was wondering why sometimes enemies seem to die easily but other times they don't. This video is a good example of why this is the case. I can understand bad accuracy shooting from the hip because that type of shot is guesswork. But aiming down the sights the bullet spread should not be at such a big range. A little more accuracy is required I think!



Edit: The bullet spread should also resemble the on-screen sights!
PM
Lance
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Jul 2003
Location: Third planet from Sun
Posted: 10th Aug 2014 15:00
I agree! Hit and miss is mostly miss .

Lance
PM
Jerry Tremble
GameGuru TGC Backer
11
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Nov 2012
Location: Sonoran Desert
Posted: 10th Aug 2014 15:15 Edited at: 10th Aug 2014 15:15
If you shoot into water, you will see clearly how bad the accuracy is even with the "iron sights". Someone else pointed this out somewhere. It's pretty bad, really puts the crap in crapshoot!

MAME Cab PC: i7 4770@3.4Ghz (passmark 9945), 12GB RAM, Win 8.1/64, GeForce GTX645 (passmark 1898); Shiny new laptop: i7 4800MQ@2.7Ghz (passmark 8586), 16GB RAM, Win 8.1/64, GeForce GTX870M (passmark 3598); Old laptop: i5@2.3Ghz, 8GB RAM, Win 7/64, Intel 3000 graphics
PM
AuShadow
GameGuru TGC Backer
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Dec 2013
Location: Australia
Posted: 10th Aug 2014 15:22 Edited at: 10th Aug 2014 15:24
Lol yep love the video, I did bring this up a while ago, a search in feature creep might bring it up there was even a response from Lee (might be in product chat not exactly sure now), but I asked for realistic ballistics, as I am a shooter myself I have a .223 rifle much same as 5.56 which is a common hunting round and ar15 round and also a .308 much same as 7.62 which is what I would guess the sniper rifle to be and this I can shoot out to 1000 yards, have also shot many a handgun of 9mm, 10mm and .45 as well as .22 and the colt should be .45 I believe which at the distance you were shooting at the bottles is quite a very accurate round. But I for one definitely do hope one day for realistic bullet drop which would mean you could shoot any distance you wanted but at a certain point that bullet will either hit the ground or lose too much velocity to remain accurate or effective by which I mean when a bullet slows down too much it gets very very inacurate.



However I also want the ability to modify the ballistics through scripting so we could pit wear effects on the gun so the more worn it is the less accurate it is and also so we could add grips and stuff during the game to increase accuracy or decrease range and things like that

PC Specs: Windows 7 home 64-bit, Amd 7900 3gb DDR5 graphics, 8gb DDR3 Ram, Intel i7 3.4ghz

Feel free to visit and edit the public FPSCR resource wiki page: http://fpscrresource.wikispaces.com/home
DVader
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 28th Jan 2004
Location:
Posted: 10th Aug 2014 15:50
I see everyone so far agrees. There are options to make things more accurate in the editor. But I think the overall system needs improving, as even at full accuracy the aim is not that much better and range doesn't seem to be much affected.

I'm sure Dirty Harry would not have used a Magnum if they were so inaccurate! He'd certainly have to feel lucky!



SPECS: Q6600 CPU. Nvidia 260GTX. 8 Gig Memory. Win 7.
synchromesh
Forum Support
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Jan 2014
Location:
Posted: 10th Aug 2014 16:56 Edited at: 10th Aug 2014 16:56
Quote: "Someone else pointed this out somewhere. It's pretty bad, really puts the crap in crapshoot!"




Ye I brought it up in an earlier thread as we keep missing the enemy and it appeared too me that the shots are just random...

If you hold a gun steady...Take aim and fire...you will see the bullet hit the ground.. Do it again...and again...and you will find the bullet randomly shoots in other directions...Sometimes a few feet apart in scale...



They don't seem to have a clear line of sight ...Perhaps if they were at least in line with the sights we could hit every time
PM
Jerry Tremble
GameGuru TGC Backer
11
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Nov 2012
Location: Sonoran Desert
Posted: 10th Aug 2014 17:05 Edited at: 10th Aug 2014 17:39
Maybe Lee bent the sites like they do at the county fair?









EDIT: (I was being sarcastic)

MAME Cab PC: i7 4770@3.4Ghz (passmark 9945), 12GB RAM, Win 8.1/64, GeForce GTX645 (passmark 1898); Shiny new laptop: i7 4800MQ@2.7Ghz (passmark 8586), 16GB RAM, Win 8.1/64, GeForce GTX870M (passmark 3598); Old laptop: i5@2.3Ghz, 8GB RAM, Win 7/64, Intel 3000 graphics
PM
Duncan Peck
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 25th Apr 2014
Location:
Posted: 10th Aug 2014 17:09
Quote: "Maybe Lee bent the sites like they do at the county fair?"


In that case you will still be able to work out the handicap and adjust where you focus on shooting to compensate. As it is it just randomly shoots all over the place.
PM
synchromesh
Forum Support
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Jan 2014
Location:
Posted: 10th Aug 2014 18:24 Edited at: 10th Aug 2014 18:27
If you played russian roulette in reloaded at the moment....You could actually live....

Even if the bullet fired
PM
wildman4
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Jan 2014
Location: South Carolina
Posted: 10th Aug 2014 22:07
Quote: "If you played russian roulette in reloaded at the moment....You could actually live....
Even if the bullet fired "


Already tried that, still here!!!
PM
bond1
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Oct 2005
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posted: 11th Aug 2014 00:18
My game design philosophy is that ALL guns should be 100% accurate, 100% of the time. That way, all skill is left up to the player. And the player have only themselves to blame for a missed shot. You can change gun attributes like strength and range, but accuracy should be perfect.

My reasoning is, what if you were playing a Mario game, and he only decided to jump 75% of the time when you pressed the jump button, all in the name of "realism"? Sounds ridiculous, right? I don't know why a lot of shooters have this mechanic. It just isn't fun to me.

SPECS: Intel Corei7 3770k, Nvidia GTX780, 16GB RAM, Win7 Pro

kW-Xport for 3ds Max:http://mjblosser.com/kw-x-port-for-3ds-max/
AuShadow
GameGuru TGC Backer
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Dec 2013
Location: Australia
Posted: 11th Aug 2014 06:00
sub machine guns and the like and rapid firing of single shot handguns even i understand, have you every tried to fire a handgun rapidly on aim???? but shoot aim shoot aim instead of shoot shoot shoot should be accurate, if that makes sense

PC Specs: Windows 7 home 64-bit, Amd 7900 3gb DDR5 graphics, 8gb DDR3 Ram, Intel i7 3.4ghz

Feel free to visit and edit the public FPSCR resource wiki page: http://fpscrresource.wikispaces.com/home
synchromesh
Forum Support
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Jan 2014
Location:
Posted: 11th Aug 2014 09:12
Quote: "My game design philosophy is that ALL guns should be 100% accurate, 100% of the time."


Agreed that would be the most realistic... I can understand from a distance not always hitting but at point blank I think we should hit the target It has been getting better on each build though. The sniper rifle I think works very accurately now
PM
QatariGameDev
GameGuru TGC Backer
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Jan 2014
Location: Doha
Posted: 12th Aug 2014 03:55
and I thought the enemies have the invincibility sometime !!
Jerry Tremble
GameGuru TGC Backer
11
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Nov 2012
Location: Sonoran Desert
Posted: 12th Aug 2014 04:19
LOL, Qatari! I thought the same thing the first time I played two compounds. I was blasting the guy at point blank range, seeing the blood decals when he was hit, many, many times, yet I was the one getting killed, over and over, and over...

MAME Cab PC: i7 4770@3.4Ghz (passmark 9945), 12GB RAM, Win 8.1/64, GeForce GTX645 (passmark 1898); Shiny new laptop: i7 4800MQ@2.7Ghz (passmark 8586), 16GB RAM, Win 8.1/64, GeForce GTX870M (passmark 3598); Old laptop: i5@2.3Ghz, 8GB RAM, Win 7/64, Intel 3000 graphics
PM
superdude911
9
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 17th Jul 2014
Location:
Posted: 12th Aug 2014 07:21
Fantastic Video, I remember having this problem in the Escape Demo where I was point blank and the guy wouldn't die.

I remember asking sometime ago in FPS Classic about having a 'feature' where the creature can adjust the accuracy of hip and iron sights separately one from another. If I remember correctly the accuracy, number of shots per Trigger Pull (or Click), and damage. Is there anyway to have one for firing from hip and one for iron sights to help the shooting feature better? also maybe a range modify-er to where the weapon should hit at a 50% or greater ratio. Just an idea, maybe it will help with the issue.

no apocalypse no game
LeeBamber
TGC Lead Developer
24
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 21st Jan 2000
Location: England
Posted: 13th Aug 2014 22:11
Wow, looks like almost 100% votes in favor of SIGNIFICANTLY improving (almost eliminating) an accuracy value. It literally is a value change across the six default weapons, but my question to game land out there is what do we put in place of the accuracy mechanic. Some games allow you to upgrade weapons and one of the modifiers is the accuracy/shake co-efficient. Are we all agreeing to simply remove accuracy variation for now, and re-use accuracy value down the road when we have a good mechanism for it, or default accuracy to deadly accurate by default and allow users to mod them to inaccurate levels as they see fit? To see what a deadly accurate Colt 1911 looks like, open the file Files\gamecore\guns\modern\colt1911\gunspec.txt and change 'accuracy = 0'

PC SPECS: Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit, Intel Core i7 920 (PASSMARK:5008), NVIDIA Geforce 9600 GT GPU (PASSMARK:752) , 6GB RAM

bond1
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Oct 2005
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posted: 14th Aug 2014 00:12 Edited at: 14th Aug 2014 00:15
Weapon upgrades should be a way to REWARD the player. They can come in the form:



-increased firing speed

-increased damage

-increased bullet capacity

-faster reloading



I know a lot of military shooters have accuracy parameters in the name of realism, but in my opinion it's just bad game design. Skill should be left up to the player, not some random number generator that determines whether it's a hit or not. If my crosshairs are lined up on an enemy's head, it better darn well register a headshot every time, or I'm going to feel cheated. I'm also not a fan of excessive gun recoil/screen shake. It's more annoying than anything and decreases fun.

SPECS: Intel Corei7 3770k, Nvidia GTX780, 16GB RAM, Win7 Pro

kW-Xport for 3ds Max:http://mjblosser.com/kw-x-port-for-3ds-max/
synchromesh
Forum Support
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Jan 2014
Location:
Posted: 14th Aug 2014 00:13 Edited at: 14th Aug 2014 00:15
Quote: "To see what a deadly accurate Colt 1911 looks like, open the file Files\gamecore\guns\modern\colt1911\gunspec.txt and change 'accuracy = 0' "




OH WOW!!



Tried it and preferred it....But if that's all I have to do to customise each gun myself then im happy with that

Thanks Lee... Each to his own setup now
PM
AuShadow
GameGuru TGC Backer
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Dec 2013
Location: Australia
Posted: 14th Aug 2014 01:29
@lee accuracy should only really be affected by thongs like recoil from rapid shooting and bullet drop from long ranges unless we get to the point of having a wind effect the extra long shots would be affected by wind, and I'm not talking huge accuracy dr
Steohl72
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 1st Sep 2013
Location: Sweden
Posted: 14th Aug 2014 09:30
Another way could be to make the crosshair moving around a bit when not using iron sight zoom (right click), and more still when using it. That would be more realistic.
I think there would be a difference in accuracy whether you are using iron sight zoom or not.

Hardware: Intel i5 3,2 Ghz - 8 GB ram - Asus NVIDIA GTX 760 - Win Pro 7 64-bit
PM
eMaRDi
11
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Oct 2012
Location: Germany
Posted: 14th Aug 2014 09:57
I agree with AuShadow.
Wind simulation would be a bit extreme to simulate.
The recent approach I saw in e.g. a popular FPS MMO is to reduce values by a range (until falloff), reload time, magazine size, burst mode, shooting rate, overheating (with machine guns) and maybe the conus with shortrange pumpguns.
Of course that would mean to measure distance from target object to source (=gun). If that's already done, a falloff could be applied. Shotguns maybe a bit harder, as a cone of bullets would exponentially lower damage but increase affected target by distance (until falloff). If that isn't already done.

To simulate wind, you may could set a minimum spread in bullet accuracy (but in any case not as high as today).
I see in the video that recoil already pulls the crosshair higher, which is good. Colt recoil seems to be a bit weak (except the player is very strong to hold the weapon in place).
Machine guns usually do only hit with the first bullet (due to the internal reload mechanic spread is significantly higher for consecutive bullets while holding the trigger).

Weapon upgrades are usually

Silencer: Lowers noise (which is not used for detection yet?) and lowers combat range (in some games)
Larger magazin capacity: Only applicable with certain weapons (as e.g. a Desert Eagle usually doesn't get a larger round due to barrel size)
Grip: For certain rifle times to lower recoil rate.
Iron Sights: Obviously only available for certain rifles; switches zoom mode to different zoom level (only one with an iron sight).

However I guess weapon upgrades would be a major change.

I think it could be useful to have an accuracy setting on an NPC. This would let the level creator decide how good someone is with a certain weapon (however this is non-player mechanics).

Spec: Windows 8.1 - i7 4770K (3,5GHz) / Z87 - 16 GB RAM - AMD 7850

FPS Creator Owner & FPS Creator Reloaded Gold Pledger (twice )
PM
synchromesh
Forum Support
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Jan 2014
Location:
Posted: 14th Aug 2014 09:57 Edited at: 14th Aug 2014 09:58
Quote: "AuShadow :lee accuracy should only really be affected by thongs "




Really....I don't wear them....Will it really improve my aim
PM
AuShadow
GameGuru TGC Backer
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Dec 2013
Location: Australia
Posted: 14th Aug 2014 11:36 Edited at: 14th Aug 2014 11:44
@synchromesh lol yeah i did type that on my phone but so all in all less spelling error's then expected, and hey im from Australia, everything's done in things



here's a chart for bullet drop on a 7.62/.308 round, as you can see it's over 60" drop
ZedClampet
9
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 15th Aug 2014
Location:
Posted: 15th Aug 2014 12:18
The aiming makes the game seem glitchy and amateurish. When you aim at something, unless it is far away or moving, you should hit it. Period.
ZedClampet
9
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 15th Aug 2014
Location:
Posted: 15th Aug 2014 13:24
Not to sound overly frustrated, but the current setup makes the game feel glitchy and amateurish. When you aim at something, you should hit it. The only exceptions should be for distance and moving targets. Period.
Jerry Tremble
GameGuru TGC Backer
11
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Nov 2012
Location: Sonoran Desert
Posted: 15th Aug 2014 23:27
I don't think you gave it enough time to get better!

MAME Cab PC: i7 4770@3.4Ghz (passmark 9945), 12GB RAM, Win 8.1/64, GeForce GTX645 (passmark 1898); Shiny new laptop: i7 4800MQ@2.7Ghz (passmark 8586), 16GB RAM, Win 8.1/64, GeForce GTX870M (passmark 3598); Old laptop: i5@2.3Ghz, 8GB RAM, Win 7/64, Intel 3000 graphics
PM
AuShadow
GameGuru TGC Backer
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Dec 2013
Location: Australia
Posted: 16th Aug 2014 05:15
Ever been to a gun range and tried to just aim and hit it period?

PC Specs: Windows 7 home 64-bit, Amd 7900 3gb DDR5 graphics, 8gb DDR3 Ram, Intel i7 3.4ghz

Feel free to visit and edit the public FPSCR resource wiki page: http://fpscrresource.wikispaces.com/home
Duncan Peck
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 25th Apr 2014
Location:
Posted: 16th Aug 2014 10:13
haha I have actually - perfect shot.. not..

I shot a fully automatic LSW (Light support weapon) back when I did CCF (Combined cadet force). I think my first bullet hit the target somewhere. The rest went all over the place. My experience.. a well placed single shot is worth more than just holding down the trigger which becomes amazingly inaccurate! Plus I'm quite a slim person so can't really hold a gun still very easily when it recoils...
PM
Steohl72
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 1st Sep 2013
Location: Sweden
Posted: 16th Aug 2014 16:09
Everyone that have done any form of military training knows that you use one shot or 3-shot - almost never full auto (exemption machine gun). That's for Hollywood and games

Hardware: Intel i5 3,2 Ghz - 8 GB ram - Asus NVIDIA GTX 760 - Win Pro 7 64-bit
PM
DVader
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 28th Jan 2004
Location:
Posted: 16th Aug 2014 20:44
I have noticed since making this video, that when altering the weapons accuracy in the editor it works a lot better. BUT, it only works once, when you run it again, the weapon is as bad as ever. You can to edit the values to the SAME setting (although they have not changed) and it will work. So I guess theres a bug there. I wondered why my Golden Gun seemed to work great then go iffy again!
I'm happy to have customization, for a game like Fallout, for leveling purposes, but having to make it a custom weapon mod for each level is not the best. I haven't noticed a way to alter this sort of thing in scripts as yet, but I may well have missed something since the latest updates.

Obviously though, the editor settings seeming to revert back to default, but stay the same in the editor being fixed, would help things enormously. I don't want to HAVE to customize each weapon individually, if I can do it within the editor. Otherwise you will end up with several clones of the same weapon, which is probably not ideal, dependent on the game of course.

I would say, either you make all weapons deadly accurate and apply a skill factor, that can alter aim, reload etc. Or keep as is, and make the settings work properly, while also giving us script commands that can affect it as wanted (if, as said they aren't already there)

Oh, and I think even when the accuracy is max, the range may be a little low still. Perhaps a range option? So we can tweak it to our liking?



SPECS: Q6600 CPU. Nvidia 660GTX. 8 Gig Memory. Win 7.
smallg
Community Leader
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Dec 2005
Location:
Posted: 16th Aug 2014 22:08 Edited at: 17th Aug 2014 17:09
edit; my mistake, i was sure i had seen a setting in the fpe but must have been dreaming



for scripting there is no actual commands but you could in theory set hidden weapons with certain settings and then "give" the player those weapons when they upgraded (although it will still have the settings not saved issue) - i believe the newest gun settings are used at least

life's one big game

windows vista ultimate

i5 @3.3ghz, 4gb ram, geforce gtx460, directx 11
Jerry Tremble
GameGuru TGC Backer
11
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Nov 2012
Location: Sonoran Desert
Posted: 17th Aug 2014 02:41
I like the idea of being able to control the accuracy of the weapon and have it become more accurate as a player becomes more experienced. I have seen this used in a few games, but that should be up to the maker of the game.

MAME Cab PC: i7 4770@3.4Ghz (passmark 9945), 12GB RAM, Win 8.1/64, GeForce GTX645 (passmark 1898); Shiny new laptop: i7 4800MQ@2.7Ghz (passmark 8586), 16GB RAM, Win 8.1/64, GeForce GTX870M (passmark 3598); Old laptop: i5@2.3Ghz, 8GB RAM, Win 7/64, Intel 3000 graphics
PM
The Next
TGC Web Engineer
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 3rd Dec 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 17th Aug 2014 11:56
With a few additional scripting commands this idea of increasing accuracy and other weapon stats would be possible via LUA, maybe if enough epople want it implemented Lee will find the time to add it in.

You have always been able to edit the files directly though to suit your needs.

Although I think by default the weapons should be more accurate as it gives a bad impression for the demo and amazing competition entries.

Windows 7 Pro, Intel i7 3.8 GHz, 16GB DDR3, NVIDIA GTX 780 4GB Superclocked
PM
Wolf
Forum Support
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Nov 2007
Location: Luxemburg
Posted: 17th Aug 2014 19:08
I find that the shooting in classic was pretty good towards the end.

"When I contradict myself, I am telling the truth"

"absurdity has become necessity"
m2design
GameGuru TGC Backer
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 25th Mar 2010
Location:
Posted: 17th Aug 2014 23:53 Edited at: 18th Aug 2014 01:58
I went to the files Lee mentioned and set the variable to "0".



Went to reloaded a did a trial run and it works just great (only thing to remember is the opponent you are trying to kill must be hit 3 times.



The 3 time requirement sees to be total ( 1 time now 2 more times later if you switch target after hitting him once).

Any combination of 3 hits seems to be the ticket. It appears the first two are just wounds.



I forgot to run the level more then once to see if the variable change holds. I will try that soon.





EDIT

I went back and ran the level several times and the variable held even after exiting the session and reloading it and running the level again.



In my test level this change makes the game play just as I think it should. Having access to this variable seems to temper my reaction to the weapons accuracy problem. If I were distributing a game I can set the variables for each weapon to vary the accuracy thus have some control over play...



Edit

This getting confusing - make the same changes to the magnum and the uzi and you only have to hit the opponent 2 times. Any weapons you place other then the start weapon, the variable also has to be changed in the editor when weapon is placed.



I guess Lee needs to decide on one control only .. I am confused.

Windows pro 8.1 with 8.1 update,64 bit|AMD FX-6200 Six-core-3.80 Ghz |CPU PASSMARK 6,142 |Memory 10GB |NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 660 SC |GPU PASSMARK 4,114
AuShadow
GameGuru TGC Backer
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Dec 2013
Location: Australia
Posted: 18th Aug 2014 02:12
if you change the weapons details in the weaponspec.txt file under your gamecore/guns/modern folder then you dont have to modify in the editor for every gun you place

PC Specs: Windows 7 home 64-bit, Amd 7900 3gb DDR5 graphics, 8gb DDR3 Ram, Intel i7 3.4ghz

Feel free to visit and edit the public FPSCR resource wiki page: http://fpscrresource.wikispaces.com/home
m2design
GameGuru TGC Backer
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 25th Mar 2010
Location:
Posted: 18th Aug 2014 04:27
@AuShadow

That is the way I thought it should work but on my system it is not the way it works.

I have gone to the spec.txt file and changed the accuracy settings for magnum, colt and uzi to "0" and saved the txt file
Went back to reloaded and plac
Teabone
Forum Support
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Jun 2006
Location: Earth
Posted: 18th Aug 2014 09:23 Edited at: 19th Aug 2014 16:32
Accuracy should be good at close range and the farther away it tapers. Not sure how you'd go about programming that though lol





I feel like I'm a Stormtropper from Starwars when I play any test game in Reloaded.

i7 -2600 CPU @ 3.40GHz - Windows 7 - 8GB RAM - Nivida GeForce 420 GT
smallg
Community Leader
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Dec 2005
Location:
Posted: 18th Aug 2014 10:52
i knew i had seen a file somewhere but yh that file only affects the start marker weapons (and the AI's weapons), seems a bit weird to have 2 different settings saved for the weapons but i guess it works ok.

generally what i did was make the player use "pick up" weapons only and adjust the settings as needed on the right click - which then means you can adjust the weapon file so that the AI can be tweaked too.

life's one big game

windows vista ultimate

i5 @3.3ghz, 4gb ram, geforce gtx460, directx 11
LeeBamber
TGC Lead Developer
24
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 21st Jan 2000
Location: England
Posted: 18th Aug 2014 11:37
If you are changing GUNSPEC.txt remember to exit the software and re-launch so the gun settings can be reloaded properly. I have added a task to V1.009 to allow accuracy to be controlled from the entity properties (if not already in there) and ensure it works, and I am also improving default accuracy for all guns as this seems to be the preferred setup. I will also make accuracy a factor of distance too (if not already in there)

PC SPECS: Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit, Intel Core i7 920 (PASSMARK:5008), NVIDIA Geforce 9600 GT GPU (PASSMARK:752) , 6GB RAM

Teabone
Forum Support
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Jun 2006
Location: Earth
Posted: 18th Aug 2014 16:28
Awesome thanks Lee for your continued hard work

i7 -2600 CPU @ 3.40GHz - Windows 7 - 8GB RAM - Nivida GeForce 420 GT
Jerry Tremble
GameGuru TGC Backer
11
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Nov 2012
Location: Sonoran Desert
Posted: 19th Aug 2014 02:06 Edited at: 20th Aug 2014 13:30
@m2design- Did you close Reloaded after changing the gunspec.txt values? And then restart? In my experience, that is necessary whenever changing values in an fpe, and I just tried the gunspec and it behaves the same way.



EDIT: Sorry, didn't see there
PM
danjo
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 29th Dec 2005
Location:
Posted: 20th Aug 2014 02:48
i cannot believe what i just read....
Uman
GameGuru TGC Backer
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Oct 2004
Location:
Posted: 20th Aug 2014 05:03 Edited at: 20th Aug 2014 05:07
Weapon accuracy (range, damage, spread, recoil and so on) should be left to the game designer to be able to set in the weapons editor properties dialogue box preferably (accuracy/range) and or at least in the weapons setup up file in the relative folders.



The default accuracy can therefore be set at anything one would like but 100% accuracy should be possible to be set.



As to the realism : trajectory, velocity, falloff and alike well that's another issue and not necessarily of the same significance to all game makers and game players for reasons you should be able to work out for yourself and is or more accurately speaking as has been alluded to potentially a minefield. The number of things in real life that can affect the accuracy of a weapon or other projectile can be many and varied in each circumstance.



If you go down that road then you should go all the way which is in my opinion beyond what Reloaded or any other game engine or other product should seek to do unless it is specifically is designed as a software to relate specifically to weapons design in ware fare use or other which is not in the main what game players are interested in though some may well be very interested in that aspect. Most game Players want fun and enjoyment and that whats Reloaded should return. In the main in the first instance as some have said a game player would normally expect to hit an object at the point of cross hair. Deviation from that is OK within reason but extremes of making a Game weapon widely inaccurate or difficult to use should be avoided by default. Let the Game designer make it more difficult if they so wish and not the other way around.



End user game player "Game Difficulty" settings may at some point be worth considering later where perhaps all things e.g. Characters, weapons and other challenges could be either chosen as a difficulty level by your game players or games designed with increasing difficulty either in a linear fashion or level by level fashion.



Getting back to the weapon realism thing this is game making and not necessarily is there any need to enforce anything hard coded as being accurate to real life. In any case achieving what is real for any individual game player as if they were using a weapon in real life is impossible as each individual would have differing capabilities, results, expectations and real time scenarios when firing any weapon at any target, static or moving which poses additional issues.



As said to go down that road if you want real then you have to have real and that means more permutations than you can ever account for............



It means accounting for human walking, running, breathing, position and stance, kneeling, laying down, balance (depending upon what you are standing upon and how stable the player is or would be in real life) as well as weather, heat, cold, time of day, shooting through grass, tree branches, twigs, water, ice, glass, wood (e.g. you can shoot through wood in real life and still hit something if on target - generally speaking we cant shoot through boxes or a fence or even metal objects, fabrics and so on and kill an enemy or vice versa in game engines - but you may well be able to do so in real life, wind, rain, snow, hailstones, flies, birds,(anything that the projectile may hit in the slightest that may impact on its angle/flight path and the further the projectile travels means a hit becomes a miss) distance/range to target estimation, vertical trajectory (shooting up/shooting down) and more.



True to say the more you do something the better sometimes, for some people they can become at it though not in for others in many instances in reality. Some find some things easier than others. Shooting a weapon in real life can be like driving a car - the more you do it the more it becomes second nature and all shooter calculations and things that have to be taken into account that one may find very difficult at first can become easier and with continual practice and effort and a lot of time, practical application and experience it becomes as said something that becomes a natural extension of oneself and the thought and physical processes become automatic and natural.



Unlike real life many game players don't have that much time available to master something. They may play your game once to the end if you are lucky and often cant wait to get to the end and complete it as fast as possible for some strange reason. If they don't like it for any reason, find it too hard or boring and repetitive or not enjoy playing it they may not even do that and give up at any stage. If they play it once they may not ever want to play it again even if they enjoy it.



Point being every game player is different, some like one thing, to another it will be a complete turn off and killer for your game. Thus think of what the majority enjoy and that's killing and not getting killed too often in return.



Most people don't mind something that's an interesting and enjoyable challenge as long as its not permanently difficult and or repetitive. By and large they like to win and achieve and be rewarded more often than fail and lose. Quite naturally.



In an fps shooter if you are going to make using weapons a bind for end users then you take the enjoyment away completely as it is their link to the game world.



Whatever game maker and game player flexibility of choice is the key. The more the better so the games made can be as hard or easy as needed, required, suitable for all depending upon the game design needs.



If you want close proximity to absolute reality then we should extrapolate that to everything else in the game world for every type of game scenario for every game player expectation. e.g. vehicles, flying objects and so on - all static and dynamic world objects which is fine.....but we may have to wait around 20 years at least to get it done unless we can get a big investment in additional development resources, money, man power and alike.



Some game Character reality would be nice. Real looking, moving, talking, eyes, facial movements and expressions and extensive real like behaviors and alike.



Liquids, realistic surfaces, ice, oil, realistic moving fabrics, leaves, plant seeds, dust, and sandstorms (Lees favorite) and so on and the list goes on and is endless.



Yes we want as much as possible and as realistic as possible but we also want a fully working game making product at an acceptable level as soon as possible by and large for the benefit of the product and all concerned. As with all things some compromise, reason and sensibility may be needed and quite likely to be so by force of necessity and reality of the development and product capability itself not to mention any commercial realities.



The real aim and skill of making a successful game is not necessarily how good it is realistically but how enjoyable it is for the end game players and that in the end is perhaps more difficult than anything else to get right.



Lees post above about improvements to weapons seems to me to be quite adequate enough for the time being.



m2design
GameGuru TGC Backer
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 25th Mar 2010
Location:
Posted: 20th Aug 2014 05:05
Has anyone noticed that when the colt is fired the crosshair sight does not react to the kick back motion. (the crosshair does not move up with each shot)
When the colt is fired the crosshair sight reacts to the kick back motion.(the crosshair moves up with each shot)

Windows pro 8.1 with 8.1 update,64 bit|AMD FX-6200 Six-core-3.80 Ghz |CPU PASSMARK 6,142 |Memory 10GB |NVIDIA GEFORCE GTX 660 SC |GPU PASSMARK 4,114
AuShadow
GameGuru TGC Backer
10
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Dec 2013
Location: Australia
Posted: 20th Aug 2014 06:27 Edited at: 20th Aug 2014 06:30
for the purpose of games i think it would be fine for bullets to be accurate for single shot weapons to a sort of infinite range but have realistic bullet drop, this would have some handgun rounds fall around 400 inches at 500 yards so with realistic bullet drop we would have appropiate range limitations, and could have some fun aiming way high to see if we hit



@Uman i am not chasing full realistic ballistics and wind and heart rate and all that just bullet drop, i find just having bullet drop makes it feel a lot more real, i would be happy with just that, but also not hard coded, i want the ability to modify the bullet drop via LUA so i can have the player pickup stuff that will affect it, or find better ammo that shoots flatter and further

PC Specs: Windows 7 home 64-bit, Amd 7900 3gb DDR5 graphics, 8gb DDR3 Ram, Intel i7 3.4ghz

Feel free to visit and edit the public FPSCR resource wiki page: http://fpscrresource.wikispaces.com/home
LeeBamber
TGC Lead Developer
24
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 21st Jan 2000
Location: England
Posted: 20th Aug 2014 12:03
I will see what I can do about some sort of bullet drop field in the GUNSPEC. Not doing setting changes in LUA for the present (need to think some more on that one and precisely how many settings need exposing). Might be a LOT of work.

PC SPECS: Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit, Intel Core i7 920 (PASSMARK:5008), NVIDIA Geforce 9600 GT GPU (PASSMARK:752) , 6GB RAM

Login to post a reply

Server time is: 2024-05-06 18:43:54
Your offset time is: 2024-05-06 18:43:54