Product Chat / Terrain question.

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nelsonaddison
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Posted: 30th Mar 2014 03:04 Edited at: 30th Mar 2014 03:05
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Eventually, will we be able to create smaller terrains? When will we be able to import/export terrain heightmaps? It's kind of a pain to recreate my terrain with every beta release.
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LeeBamber
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Posted: 10th Apr 2014 00:29
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You can simply save your level as an FPM, then when the next beta is installed, simply load the old FPM and your terrain is restored. There will also be support eventually for importing whole geometry to replace the terrain system, and the current beta even has a flag called superflatterrain=0 which when set to 1 will completely skip the terrain system allowing you to place your own entities down that can mimic terrain or even cityscapes.

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Jerry Tremble
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Posted: 10th Apr 2014 06:54
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Do I understand that correctly? We can already replace the terrain with a "terrain entity"? If so, that answers a lot of questions that I've seen floating around these boards as of late and opens up a world (pun intended) of possibilities for myself and many others. Thanks, Lee!
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LeeBamber
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Posted: 10th Apr 2014 11:31
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Yep, just set terrain to flat terrain in SETUP.INI then create a polygon collision based entity and drop it in. You will have your new world geometry but there will be no clever occlusion, culling or optimization on it as it was just dragged in from the outside world (pun intended).

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nelsonaddison
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Posted: 10th Apr 2014 12:56 Edited at: 10th Apr 2014 13:04
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I tested this out and it is very cool. The only thing to note is that it creates a single flat terrain that you cannot edit. You can then import a terrain entity and put it on top of the flat terrain. That means that Reloaded's water system will not be available either as it is below the flat terrain. I wonder if it is possible to create your own water entity as well.



Edit: or if there is a variable you can set to place the flat terrain below water level.
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unfamillia
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Posted: 10th Apr 2014 13:45
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Is the terrain model still eating up a lot of polys? Is there anyway of completely removing the terrain model and just building a level into 'open space'?



I myself don't really want to build many (if any) outside levels so, I am all about speed and saving resources.



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nelsonaddison
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Posted: 11th Apr 2014 00:26
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The flat terrain does not appear to have any polys - maybe one for the plane itself. The memory meter is much lower.
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Jerry Tremble
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Posted: 12th Apr 2014 06:20
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nelsonaddison: I think at that point (haven't tried it, yet) you would either need a variable to move the water plane up, not move your mesh down, since you would be slicing through the original flat terrain. It would be a GREAT time to put your own water planes in, at you own desired sizes and levels. I don't see why we couldn't do that now, anyway. However, as Lee said, there will be no culling of those unwanted entities. (the original water plane and terrain). That would definitely take a bite out of performance. The next beta, however, might give us enough of a performance boost to make this worthwhile!
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nelsonaddison
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Posted: 12th Apr 2014 07:44
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Is there a way to put the water shader onto your own imported entity?
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Jerry Tremble
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Posted: 12th Apr 2014 14:39
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I'm not 100% sure, never messed with the shaders, but I would probably start by changing the effect in the fpe file. Maybe someone will chime in here and confirm that?
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tommy8
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Posted: 13th Apr 2014 07:39
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Why would you want a smaller terrain?



Personally I hope in a future build we could make even bigger ones.
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nelsonaddison
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Posted: 14th Apr 2014 01:24
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A smaller terrain eats up less memory, leaving more resources for other things like entities. Why would you not want the option of a smaller terrain?
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Jerry Tremble
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Posted: 14th Apr 2014 01:51
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Also, if you enter a building, you may not even want the computer thinking about the outside world. Culling isn't perfect. You could load the building interior as a separate world, and therefore really go to town on interior details without worrying about performance issues.
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LeeBamber
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Posted: 15th Apr 2014 20:53
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The terrain is 2 polygons and one draw call, takes up almost nothing except for the shader applied to it. I dare say we could get a few more FPS if we completely hide it. Added to list.



I have added a new item to the list which calls for a slider which can move the water plane higher and lower. Eventually volumes of water would be the preferred way to do all your water landscaping.



Replacing the water plane with your own object and apply the water shader to that is a nice idea. Ideas on how this can be incorporated into the UX would be welcomed!

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DVader
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Posted: 25th Apr 2014 16:33
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I tried adding the water shader to an object with very odd results a month or so ago. It certainly didn't look like water! I think some knowledge of how to tweak the shader would be needed as well! i'm pretty sure the object is deleted now, but if I still have it I will put up a screenshot of how it looks.



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synchromesh
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Posted: 25th Apr 2014 22:19
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Quote: "I have added a new item to the list which calls for a slider which can move the water plane higher and lower. Eventually volumes of water would be the preferred way to do all your water landscaping."




Fantastic !! The same as X10....Dare I ask if the other sliders options for water in X10 may be considered.....They were excellent features
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DolphinLover30
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Posted: 26th Apr 2014 08:59 Edited at: 26th Apr 2014 09:01
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I just downloaded it and reading this wonder if levels like in classic are the same so I could make a simple terrain then level up when I enter a building completely devoid of terrain geometry and just the building??



EDIT: I use L3DT and TerraGen 2 for terrains in other game engines ... would be cool to import one of those here,

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tomjscott
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Posted: 7th May 2014 00:54
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Quote: "Yep, just set terrain to flat terrain in SETUP.INI then create a polygon collision based entity and drop it in. You will have your new world geometry but there will be no clever occlusion, culling or optimization on it as it was just dragged in from the outside world (pun intended)."




What if the terrain entity was broken up into segments and a segment was behind the camera? Wouldn't that be a candidate for general culling?



I'm assuming we'd lose the ability to paint grass on terrain as well. The idea is tempting, but I think maybe too many limitations at this point.
LeeBamber
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Posted: 8th May 2014 20:21
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The engine does not cull by limb, only by object so you would have to break the imported level into many entities which will become unworkable as a pipeline. Probably best to hold out for an automated approach.

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tomjscott
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Posted: 8th May 2014 20:27
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Quote: "The engine does not cull by limb, only by object so you would have to break the imported level into many entities which will become unworkable as a pipeline. Probably best to hold out for an automated approach."




Right now I'm definitely not thinking of using this for an entire level's terrain. However, I am definitely looking at creating some terrain segments in another tool and using them to solve specific problems in certain areas. So, I'm glad that nelsonaddison brought this up since it has given me some ideas.



Thanks for the input, Lee.
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